The Trinity in SDA Church by Dwayne Lemon.

[SevenThunders-sici]

@ 3:52 of the video, in reference to the belief, understanding and position of the founders of the church, the minister states that we are to...
'look at not so much as what they said in words, but what they understood in concept'.
But
How does one convey their 'concept' except through the words they say?
Is it being suggested that we are to read the mind of any given pioneer?
And what of understanding our Bible? Are we to do the same?
Are we to discard the plain words of 'take the Bible as it reads'?
And instead resort to a concept? Does this not open wide the door to 'private interpretations'?

[godmichael]

After they created the earth and the animals on it, the Father and Son carried out their intention, planned before the fall of Satan, to make human beings in their own image. They had worked together in the creation of the earth and every living thing upon it. And now God said to His Son, “Let us make man in our image.”

FATHER AND HIS SON

[rudolfberki]

I was born into a SDA family and always believed in the ‘trinity: god the father, god the son, and god the holy spirit” doctrine until recently; however, studying the Scriptures with the Spirit of Prophecy and our Pioneers beliefs, I can wholeheartedly say I was dead wrong and all those who believe as such are wrong too, as the trinity doctrine is a false pagan doctrine which was brought into the church primarily by LeRoy Froom whom I found to be a Jesuit Catholic priest and more likely joined the SDA church for the sole purpose to deceive and mislead many thus leading them to perdition. Please study the Scriptures and Spirit of Prophecy diligently with prayer and find out for yourself that NONE of our Pioneers nor Sister White believed in the trinity. For example, she refuted Dr Kellog and a preacher by the name Chapman who came to believe in “god the father, god the son and god the holy spirit”, three gods in unity or “triune god”, thus “god the holy spirit” being a different person to the Father and to the Son [Jesus Christ.] Here just a few quotes from Sister White and some of our Pioneers on this matter, which trinitarians are ignoring if not despising:

"Cumbered with humanity, Christ could not be in every place personally; therefore it was altogether for their advantage that He should leave them, go to His Father, and send the Holy Spirit to be His successor on earth. The Holy Spirit is Himself, divested of the personality of humanity, and independent thereof. He would represent Himself as present in all places by His Holy Spirit, as the Omnipresent. “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall [although unseen by you] teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. ... Nevertheless, I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.” {Lt119-1895.18}

"The Son of God shared the Father's throne, and the glory of the eternal, self-existent One encircled both. . . . none but Christ, the Only Begotten of God, could fully enter into His purposes, and to Him it was committed to execute the mighty counsels of His will" (PP, p. 36).

"After the earth was created, and the beasts upon it, the Father and Son carried out their purpose, which was designed before the fall of Satan, to make man in their own image. They had wrought together in the creation of the earth and every living thing upon it. And now God says to his Son, "Let us make man in our image." (ST Jan. 9, 1879; par. 13).

"In the beginning the Father and the Son had rested upon the Sabbath after Their work of creation." (DA p.769, par.2).

“The Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of the Father, is truly God in infinity, but not in personality. Ellen White, Upward Look, page 367

“Christ has given HIS Spirit as a divine power.” — (E.G. White, RH, Nov 19, 1908)

“How few realize that Jesus, unseen, is walking by their side!” — (E.G. White, 14MR 125.3)

“He [Christ] is an unseen presence in the PERSON of the HOLY SPIRIT, ” — (E.G. White, DG 185.2, 1897)

“As by faith we look to Jesus, our faith pierces the shadow, and we adore God for His wondrous love in giving JESUS THE COMFORTER.” — (E.G. White, 19MR 297.3)

“The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God; it is also the Spirit of Christ.” U. Smith, GC Daily Bulletin, Vol. 4, March 1891, pp. 146, 147

“The Holy Spirit is the SPIRIT OF CHRIST; it is HIS REPRESENTATIVE.” — (E.G. White, 13MR 313.3, 1895)

“Here we find that the Holy Spirit is both the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ.” E. J. Waggoner, Christ and His Righteousness, p. 23, 1890

“We learn from this language that when we speak of the Spirit of God we are really speaking of his presence and power.” J. N. Loughborough, Review & Herald, September 13, 1898

“The divine Spirit that the world’s Redeemer promised to send is the presence and power of God.” Signs of the Times, November 23, 1891

“We want the Holy Spirit, which is Jesus Christ.” E. G. White, Lt66, April 10, 1894

“Jesus comes to you as the Spirit of Truth; study the mind of the Spirit, consult your Lord, follow His way.” — (E.G. White, 2MR 337.1)

“We cannot be with CHRIST in person, as were His first disciples, but He has sent HIS HOLY SPIRIT to GUIDE US INTO ALL TRUTH, and through this power we too can bear witness for the Saviour. [John 16:13 quoted]” — (E.G. White, Ms30, June 18, 1900)

“CHRIST declared that the divine influence of HIS SPIRIT was to be with His followers UNTO THE END. From the DAY OF PENTECOST to the present time, the COMFORTER has been sent to all who have yielded themselves fully to the Lord and to His service.” — (E.G. White, AA, 49.2)

“…THERE ARE TWO SPIRITS IN THE WORLD, - THE SPIRIT OF GOD AND THE SPIRIT OF SATAN.” Ellen White, Signs of the Times, November 24, 1887, par. 7

And when He had said this, He [Christ] breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: ... Before the disciples could fulfil their official duties in connection with the church, Christ breathed His Spirit upon them.” — (E.G. White, Desire of Ages, p. 805)

“Christ came to our world, but the world could not endure His purity. He has gone to His Father, but He has sent His Holy Spirit to represent Him in the world till he shall come again.” — (E.G. White, Ms1, Jan 11, 1897)

“The Father and the Son Alone are to be exalted.” — (E.G. White, YI, July 7, 1898)

This is another statement of Sister White which says, I quote:

Before the entrance of evil, there was peace and joy throughout the universe. All was in perfect harmony with the Creator’s will. Love for God was supreme, love for one another impartial. Christ the Word, the only begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father, —one in nature, in character, and in purpose, —the only being in all the universe that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. (Great Controversy, 493)

If this is true, then, how is it that Christ was the ONLY BEING in all the universe that could enter into ALL THE COUNSELS and PURPOSES of God? Where was the ’god the holy spirit?’ After all, if he is ‘god’ being co-eternal and co-equal with the Father, how is it that he could not enter into all the counsels and purposes of God?

For example, in John 14:1, John 17:3 and 1 Corinthians 8:6 where we read, I quote,

"... ye believe in God, believe also in me." (John 14:1); - two divine beings, and not three!

"And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3); again two divine beings, and not three!; and

"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him." (1 Corinthians 8:6)

Please note that apostle Paul clearly and plainly spelt it out that "...to us there is but one God, the Father" and "one Lord Jesus Christ." Now, if the ONE GOD would consist of three Divine and Co-eternal Beings, as trinitarians believe, then he would have said "but to us there is but one God: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, " but he did not say that.

In the New Testament we find ONLY two divine beings, the Father and the Son. For example, Jesus told His disciples He is the Comforter. (John 14:16-18) In verse 18 Jesus called the "Comforter" the "Spirit of Truth" and the "Spirit of Truth" is none other than Christ Himself! (John 14:6) Another example, in John 10:30 we read, I quote, Jesus said "I and my Father are one." This verse does not say, "I and the Father, and the Holy Spirit are one God." Again, in Revelation we find only two Divine Beings sitting on the throne, but no where do we find the Holy Spirit as a separate being to the Father and to the Son. We have to be very careful not to take the Scripture out of context since it interprets itself, as throughout the whole Scripture the Holy Spirit is referred to as the Spirit of God and of Christ.

The Scriptures tell us that the Holy Spirit is the 'Spirit of God' (Genesis 1:2; 41:38; Exodus 31:3; 35:31; Numbers 24:2; 1 Samuel 10:10; 19:20, 23; 2 Chronicles 24:20; Job 27:3; Ezekiel 11:24; Mat. 3:16; 12:28; etc.) or the 'Spirit of the Lord God' (Isaiah 21:1) and Spirit of Jesus Christ (Philippians 1:19; 1 Peter 1:11), and not a separate divine being from the Father and the Son, as it never refers to as the 'Lord' or 'God' the Holy Spirit.

Also, NONE should use the book Evangelism by Leroy Froom as it is an adulterated book in which the author altered Sister White's writings which on the surface may seem to support the trinity doctrine, however in reality, if read in context, not one single statement does; therefore the speaker is utterly wrong.

We MUST be very careful in what we believe as the devil is running to and fro on the face of this earth to deceive and to devour as many as he can. Therefore, study the Scriptures, the Spirit of Prophecy and the history of the church including the beliefs of our Pioneers for yourselves and let none foul you. We need to be like the Bereans, who went home and studied the Scriptures for themselves to see if it were so!

[kanyohoho]

1.God is 1 being( John 17:3). 2. Jesus is the only begotten Son of God( Proverbs 8:22-30) 3. The holy spirit is the presence of God( John 14: 16, 18, 22, 23). The Bible alone is the building material for doctrine( 2 Timothy 3:16-17)

[BarRafiSimon]

3:06 - This is the heresy of modalism, not the historic definition of the Trinity. Its dubious to claim that in the mid-1800s, modalism was popular among the the American Episcopal Church, The Methodist Episcopal Church, The Reformed Church, The Roman Catholic Church, The Byzantine Orthodox Church, the Coptic Orthodox Church, etc.; all of them would have all rejected this definition as heresy. It simply wasn't the case that this was the popular view that the SDA Pioneers were reacting against.

[KevisHarry]

The baptism of Jesus . Do you read Desire of Ages? Pls read it. Is it a dove? Check it out preacher. I did and it was contrary to what you just teach.

[seekingthelostministries]

I think anti-trinitarians are missing some very important facts in their theology.

First they are saying there are two Jesus’s. One physical and one spiritual.

If that is the case then how did Jesus really experience the true death if he was also still alive as the Holy Spirit?

True death is separation from the Father and Jesus could not experience that if he was also the Holy Spirit.

Second, they think a spirit must belong to someone. This is spiritualism and error. The correct understanding is a spirit IS someone.

God IS a spirit. Every demon that was cast out had a distinct personality, some even gave their names, and they were spirits.

The idea that a spirit must belong to someone in the sense that it is a “spirit form” of that someone comes from the first great lie Satan told in the garden (thou shall not surely die).

Third, the doctrine that Christ is actually the Holy Spirit comes from trinitarian theology wherein they believe God is all three persons in one being. Anti-Trinitarians actually hold Trinitarian beliefs of co-substantiation. The irony.

If you read the Bible and SoP without the spiritualism blinders we have all been inundated with since birth, you will understand that “spirit of” simply means sent from and representative of, instead of the spiritualism view of beings having an immortal spirit within them, that is actually them.

The pick-and-choose theology of anti-Trinitarians is not biblical. We are to live by EVERY word, not discard some of it when it does not fit into what we want to believe.

Further, EVERY word must harmonize with every other as all of it came from the same source.

When you do that you understand the Godhead, the counterfeit Trinity, and can reconcile that the Father and Son are the only two we are to give worship to even though the Holy Spirit is a divine person and distinct personality, that we are NOT directed to worship.

Therein lies the mystery that we cannot understand, but instead of making up a theology so we can have a perfect human understanding, simply take what the Lord has given us by faith 🙏🏾

[Jrakery]

This man is a wolf in sheep's clothing. Wilson "the president of SDA" admits y'all serve the same trinity as the papacy. This man is a liar, period!

[therockfortress]

A quick update.

To our question, “Is the One God who is a unity of three persons also a person himself? That is, will we see the one in three god in heaven when we get there? Does this triune god have the throne of his own besides that of the Father and of the Son?”

We have received several conflicting answers.

1. A pastor said yes, the three persons make up one person. Asked to clarify how, the pastor has not come back to me yet.

2. A theologian said, they do not make one person, it is impossible to make one person from three persons. The Father is the unity of the trinity, and He is the One God. That raises many questions. If the Father is the One God, where is the triune God? How can the Father be a unity of himself and two others, to make one, if he is already the one?

3. Another person whose title is unknown said that the three persons of the trinity do not form one person. They are One God only in terms of having one purpose.

4. From our previous experiences, we have heard some say the One God of the Bible is the Godhead, i.e. just a divinity or deity, without further clarity on what that is?

5. Another person said the One God is a mystery, thus leaving the One God undefined. Sounds like a quick way for human wisdom to escape accountability for the confusion that human wisdom has created (akin to pleading insanity in court). We raise an issue with this unexplained mystery of human wisdom. The trinity doctrine, that is put together by human minds gives us the triune God. Thus, those who made the trinity doctrine must be able to explain it. In other words, we are not questioning the Bible, but the trinity doctrine, because the trinity doctrine is a product of human wisdom.

I don’t know about you, but this sounds like a lot of confusion. It seems there is no one with a clear understanding of what this human creation called the triune god is? To those who say it is a mystery we question. Why should human wisdom create a doctrine which it cannot explain and cannot understand? Is that not a reason to discard the doctrine and return to that only which the Bible says, that there is One God, the Father, who has Only One begotten Son. The One God, the Father has and is also a Spirit? No three equal persons making up confusion?



Regards,

The Rock Fortress Ministries

[DonjohnsonBG]

Leroy Froom wasn’t a pioneer He was 15 years old when Ellen White Died

[kennethjaikens]

Wonderful explanation. I have learnt a lot. However I wonder how I can get a copy of that work to my email too😄.
I need to understand more

[christopherreynos]

Ellen G White is to Sda as Mohammed is to Islam. There is no leaving out Ellen

[za-jmwf]

It's unfortunate the Spirit many anti trinitarian breath manifest. And I speak from experience. That alone speaks what spirit they're from

[restoringtheremnant]

Wow. People who have the original writings prove that it was tampered with. The Trinity is not biblical nor is it in the spirit of Prophecy. Dwayne lemon, you look like you were pretty offended from that question. This is why we shouldn't be trusting in these pastors in our church because they are deceiving so many!

[DonjohnsonBG]

True the Holy Spirit is a person with a personality but it’s not a separate divine being it’s Christ own person it’s his omnipresence spirit Paul clearly says the Lord is that Spirit (2 Cor 3:17) meaning its him not someone who represents him

[DonjohnsonBG]

In Acts Chapter 5 you have to remember what Peter and the others understood the manifestation of the Holy Spirit would be, Christ says in John 14:23 the Father and himself would make their abode. And Peter acknowledge both by saying You lied unto God and ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord

[guversuiam]

Holy spirit is not a person .
The holy spirit is a Jesus.

Jonh 14:18

[a.lavernefilan]

There seems to be a lot of SDA Babylonian confusion going on, on this topic. Could some current SDA leader's watch 4 YouTube video's by 'Cocoa SDA Church'? The first is 'The Quest for the Doctrine of the Trinity' and the 2nd is 'A Comparison of the SDA & Roman Catholic Trinitarian Positions', and the last 2 have the same name as the last one. Pastor Devron Thomas ThD (C) is the speaker. Is what he is saying the current SDA theological belief's as I have heard other SDA's state other belief's. Pastor Thomas goes into much more detail then I have heard other's go into and I don't wish to misrepresent the SDA Church's current position on the topic. Other YouTube videos to watch are, 'The Future of Unity & the Trail of the 🐍 Serpent 🐍- Judgement Hour' and 'But Whom Say Ye That I Am? (Part 1&2) - Judgement Hour'. These last three video's show changes in the SDA Doctrine of GOD. Are they accurate or is Pastor Thomas the one that is correct on where the SDA organization is and is headed? If you know anyone who is willing to officially clarify this matter please solicit their input.

[DonjohnsonBG]

At the Baptism Jesus is in the water now Who does the Bible say the Spirit belongs to in Matthew 3:16? Is it not God? It didn’t say the Spirit of the Holy Spirit or in Luke 3:22 God the Holy Ghost. Christ accredit the voice and shape of the dove to the Father at the Baptism notice what Christ says in John 5:36-37 “But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.
37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.” Did not the Father witness that Jesus was his beloved Son at the Baptism by voice and shape?

[christopherreynos]

The SDA committ blastphemy by intentionally lying to people with not only conspiracy theories that are far fetched, they belive in three beings in God. to believe in tree beings is believing in three Gods. they use thr trinity to lure people to their church, when actually they don't believe it. to say three persons in one being is appropriate. you cannot have three beings in one person. Aam and eve are two seperate beings of the same substance.