What did the SDA Pioneers say about the Trinity doctrine? (Short version)

The doctrine of the Trinity, a controverted topic that has become a discussion in the past several years, particularly among Seventh-day Adventists. Is it Biblical and was it always part of the Seventh-day Adventist church? How is it that one God can be three and is Jesus Christ the Son of God or is this a role that Christ took upon himself for the plan of salvation? These are questions, among many others, that many are studying and trying to understand today. The goal of this short presentation is to allow the Seventh-day Adventist pioneers to speak for themselves to see what it is that they had to say with respect to the doctrine of the Trinity and the identity of God.

[chrischung]

@3:48 note that James White rejected the Catholic false trinity but viewed the SD Baptist trinity in a totally different light:

James White(1876): "The principal difference between the two bodies is the immortality question. The S. D. Adventists hold the divinity of Christ so nearly with the trinitarian, that we apprehend no trial here. . . . "
Seventh-day Adventists and Seventh Day Baptists cannot afford a controversy on doctrines which neither regard as tests of Christian character." (Review and Herald,  October 12, 1876, p. 116, col. 2.)

James died before EGW made it clear that there are “three living persons” that comprise the “Heavenly Trio” and he only believed in two divine persons. The leaders that were alive when EGW made it clear that the Holy Spirit is a third person we’re shocked. Note:

ML Andreasen wrote: "How astonished we were when Desire of Ages was first published, for it contained some things that we considered unbelievable; among others the doctrine of the Trinity, which was not generally accepted by the Adventists then.”

[gfritz]

I believe the trinity and sanctuary doctrines will be what causes the great shaking…

[niviadouse]

The Lord is soon to come. We want that complete and perfect understanding which the Lord alone can give. It is not safe to catch the spirit from another. We want the Holy Spirit, which is Jesus Christ. If we commune with God, we shall have strength and grace and efficiency. 9LtMs, Lt 66, 1894, par. 18

[GrantLeitma]

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. Answers the question. Pioneers differed on many topics. As closer study was made with the help of Ellen White SOP the teachings became clear especially after 1888. James White, Uriah Smith, Haskel, Wilcox understood the true meaning of the Godhead by 1904. They changed their positions .

[dianeperkins]

Your teachings are really more in agreement with the ‘Mother’ Church, your friends the Catholic teaching of the Trinity.

[streamsoflightministries]

Holy Spirit just gave me some insight on his personhood.
Ephesians 4:30
And GRIEVE not the Holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Grieving is an emotion. An inanimate force that is not abstract or in a parable does not have emotions. This is proof among others that Holy Spirit has a separate personhood in the Godhead.

[glendagoss]

This doesn’t make any sense to me. Jesus is the word..the word was made flesh.the Holy Spirit was also with God and the word at the beginning of the created world. Says so in Genesis. The Holy Spirit is given us as a comforter when Jesus returned to heaven. They are three presences because Christ said He was head of the church but not head of the Father. Nor was the Holy Spirit head of Christ or God the Father. However we are overlooking what Oneness means. It is heavenly and not worldly in its concept. In our meager attempt to understand..we called it the Trinity…how foolish we all are. How do we label God?

[sabbatskoollesssl]

Why is everyone missing the point? The pioneers was against the idee that God is three persons in one being. That the Father is the Son and the Son is the Father. Obviously same with the Holy Spirit. This is what they was against. Not that there are three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, three distinct persons. This they believed. E G White wrote exactly that; 'the heavenly Trio'. The definition of the trinity is have changed through time and between different denominations. The Trinity explained and believed by the SDA Church, is what the pioneers believed and also EG White. You are being when you say they rejected and did not believe like we do now. Sure, coming from different backgrounds and denominations, they had differences and ideas. But that got sorted out as the third Person of the Godhead leaded them to what is found in EG White's writings. That there is three co-eternal persons in the Godhead'. The disagreement was if the Father and Son was one individual or two separate beings.

[Ricky-esvg]

Glory to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit both now and ever unto the ages of ages amen!

[kenlouderback]

Amazingly your full deception is evident when you quote many early pioneers without proper context and then most amazingly you completly fail to quote the most prolific religious female writer of all time, Ellen G White. The one primary theological voice of all the early pioneers not only correctly understood the doctrine of the "Heavenly Trio" she wrotie extensivly on this topic. In her book "Evangelism" in chapter 148 she warns that "Men who are studying the sciences of satanic origin, through which Satan is working to make a nonentity of God and of Christ." page 613.3. AND she state on page 614 the trio of the Godhead, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. "There are three living persons of the heavenly trio: in the name of these three great powers - the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit." AGAIN on page 616.5 she state "WE need to realize that the Holy Spirit, who is as much a person as God is a person, is walking these ground." And you will fail yet again to try to state she changed her opinion because when she was 17 years old and started receiving communications from God she stated in her book Early Writings chapter 1, that many where trying to say her visions where self mezmerisation and to disbelieve in the Holy Spirit.
False teachers are not heaven bound. Repent and turn from your evil ways before it is too late for you.

[dohnlabalaba]

The light will grow brighter until Jesus comes again. The SDA understanding of tirnity of today is biblical which is totaly differnt from Roman Catholicism. E. G. White supported the trinity doctrine.

[ElijahAndMoses]

THE SECOND COMMANDMENT, THE TRINITY AND THE OMNIPRESENCE OF GOD

I always wondered what was so significant about the second Commandment that Rome found it necessary to remove it altogether from the Ten Commandments. But it appears that there is a fundamental truth in that Commandment concerning where God's presence is that is intended to protect us from all forms of false worship.

The second Commandment tells us that we should not bow down before any image. This implies that God is not in any image. Which means that God is not everywhere. The Bible tells us that God is in heaven; and heaven is not everywhere. Heaven is above the earth and that is where we should direct our worship to God, where He is. He knows everything that happens everywhere and can go wherever He pleases but His abode is in heaven where Jesus, our High Priest and intercessor, is presenting our cases to Him. - "Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens" (Heb. 8:1).

Furthermore, both the prophets Daniel and John saw God in heaven with the angels gathered around His throne and Jesus being separate and distinct (Dan. 7 and Rev. 4, 5). Daniel said "the Ancient of days did sit" (Dan. 7:9) and "one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days" (Dan. 7:13). John said "one sat on the throne" (Rev. 4:2) who was worshipped as the Creator to whom it was said "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created" (Rev. 4:11), with Jesus appearing before Him to receive a book and power and authority, as the Lamb who was slain, while the angels sang, "Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." (Rev. 5:13).

God is not everywhere all at once like a vapour while part of Him or an image sits on the throne representing Him. God Himself sits, of whom man was made in His image after His likeness, "made after the similitude of God" (James 3:9).

Logically, if God is everywhere, He can be worshipped wherever He is. One could then bow down and worship before a stone, a tree, a person or any object, not as worshipping the object but as worshipping God, since God is in it. That would open the door for the worship of false Gods as no one would be able to tell the difference whether you are worshipping the true God or not.

It would not be consistent to forbid worshipping before an object if God is in the object and one is worshipping, not the object, but God who is in the object. This is evident in the experience of the children of Israel in the wilderness. God appeared to them in a cloud and they were not forbidden to bow before Him in the cloud - "And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud" (Ex. 19:9), "And all the people saw the cloudy pillar stand at the tabernacle door: and all the people rose up and worshipped, every man in his tent door" (Ex. 33:10). If God is not in a particular place, say in an image, it means that there is at least one place where He is not. He cannot be everywhere and not everywhere at the same time.

The idea that the Holy Spirit is God present everywhere was precisely the argument that Dr. John Harvey Kellogg put forward to justify his pantheistic teachings. And Ellen White told him that he was wrong. Initially, he said that God was in everything. And when God instructed Ellen White to oppose it, he modified it by saying that at the time of his first presentation of the matter in the book "The Living Temple" he did not believe in the Trinity. Because of that, he said he had not given a clear explanation of the matter. He went on to explain that he had now come to believe in the Trinity and could better explain his idea. The new explanation was that it was not God the Father, but God the Holy Ghost who was everywhere and in everything. Ellen White told him that he was wrong. And we can see why. If God the Holy Spirit is everywhere and can be worshipped, it is a doorway to replace worshipping God and Christ in heaven entirely.

Another modified version of Kellogg's idea is that the Holy Spirit is really Christ himself or both God and Christ in an omnipresent form. This is also not correct as it places God and Christ on earth rather than in heaven.

The pioneers of Seventh-day Adventism stated in their Fundamental Principles of faith published in the 1889 Yearbook that God was everywhere present by His representative, the Holy Spirit. At face value, this would suggest that this representative is omnipresent. But it is perhaps more consistent with scripture to say that He is everywhere present by His representatives the holy spirits. Holy spirits are ministering spirits sent from heaven - "And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man." (John1:51). "Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?" (Heb. 1:14).

This is consistent with the Hebrew word ruach and the Greek word pneuma that are translated in the Bible as spirit. These words are also translated spirits, thus indicating that the Holy Spirit need not be seen as one individual being who is omnipresent but many spirit beings representing God everywhere.

From this perspective, there is no denying that the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, sent at Pentecost is a person - only not a God-being to be worshipped. Like the Angel of Revelation 18 who comes down from heaven with the latter rain - a similar occurrence as that which took place at Pentecost except more extensive - the Comforter would be seen as a messenger sent by Christ from heaven, as stated repeatedly in John 14-16. Ellen G. White describing the latter rain speaks of a mighty angel from heaven being sent to do this work and further said, "Angels were sent to aid the mighty angel from heaven" (Ellen. G. White, Story of Redemption, p. 399).

It should be noted that Jesus's warning against blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is not implying that the Holy Spirit is more to be revered than Jesus Himself. Jesus went back to heaven and promises to return to this earth to take us to His Father's house in heaven. He left the Holy Spirit to guide us until He returns. If we reject that guidance by blasheming against the the Holy Spirit, there will be nobody to guide us. The situation is similar to what God told the children of Israel in the wilderness - "Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him." (Ex. 23:20, 21). It is simply warning us not to reject the Holy Spirit's guidance. It is not forbidding us seeking to understand who the Holy Spirit is or what the Holy Spirit does.

So, there we have it. The church has now fully accepted Kellogg's idea. Ellen White said that the initial presentation by Kellogg was the alpha of deadly heresies. She said that the omega would follow shortly afterwards and would be accepted. And it did follow shortly afterwards in Kellogg's modified version, based on his acceptance of the Trinity. And the church has now fully accepted it - that God (the Holy Spirit) is everywhere and should be worshipped. So, based on current practice, Jesus is worshipped, the Holy Spirit is worshipped but the One true God is almost entirely ignored. Jesus, praying to His Father, made it clear who the "only true God" is and identified Himself as the one sent by God - "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3).

Nowhere in the Bible is worship given to anyone else except the one seated on the throne who is referred to as "LORD God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come" (Rev.4:8) and to the Christ, the Lamb, as it will be in the new earth - "And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it." (Rev. 21:22). God is the Father of Christ. Accordingly, Christ, the Lamb is seen with "an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads" (Rev. 14:1). It is the name of the Lamb's Father that will be written in their foreheads.

Whatever one's concept of the Godhead, the term "godhead" is used only three times in the Bible (Acts 17:29, Rom. 1:20 and Col. 2:9) and in none of these places is the expression used to replace the idea of God being a single individual who has a Divine Son who is worshipped alongside Himself. And not even once does the term "godhead" in scripture allude to the worship of anyone else.

All worship should be directed to God and Christ in heaven. It is not about where we are when we worship but, like sending a petition to the king of England, we do not send it to Spain or Australia but to him in England where he is. Similarly, Jesus in teaching us how to pray directed that we say, "Our Father which art in heaven".

We should not be praying to nor worshipping anything on earth. We should pray to God in heaven, approaching His throne through Christ, our Mediator, and we should direct our worship to heaven where God is. This is the substance of the second Commandment that Rome has removed.

[jameso.]

Why didn't you include ALL of the statements made by the SDA prophetess, Ellen G. White concerning the "trinity" - because they clearly contradict all of the statements made by the "early SDA founders" concerning the trinity.

[davechristensen]

In Hebrew numerology the NUMBER OF MAN is 6. And so 666 is a god who is THREE MEN. The Pope wears 666 on his tiara, and it is the basis of all the Roman Church's teachings. So if you worship a Trinity, you are sealed with 666. Good luck with that! SDA, go back to your Pioneers and worship the Creator of heaven and earth. If the First Angel wanted us to proclaim a Trinity, it would have said that. It didn't.

[buyinzafredrick]

Sadly, This thing of anti trinitrian is move around the world 🌎 it's sad that you cant tell them nothing even if you read the bible😢 they are as hard as gold😅 bitter sweet

[chuckiejayjala]

Very nice explanation. I pray that not only other SDA would know this also to all people who deceived by the Pagan Roman Trinity.

[juanperez-mmml]

That understanding wasn’t revealed to them at that point in time. The pioneers were constantly growing in faith and knowledge and light was being shown to them little by little. Well now we have received that light and it is precious. Just as they received and understood the health messege, the sabbath, the ministry of Christ in the most holy place and other things, so this would have been shown to them but it wasn’t the time.

This sort of video with all its honest intentions only sends a few messages:
1. Satan has been involved in our teachings, therefore we can not trust the church.
2. We can only believe in the principles the pioneers had at that time, any other belief must be examined to the light they had.

Brother in Christ, there’s a reason we believe in PRESENT TRUTH, there’s light still to be shown upon us. As I know you will pray for me once you read and understand we are in disagreement, I will also do the same for you are only being sincere in the light you have.

[benneal]

133 likes 133 comments 100% truth after listening through and reading all the comments I may have something to add Isaiah 9 v 6 when the original septugint is compared it reads rather differently to the kjv the 1st parts basically the same upto shoulder... and his name is called the messenger of great council, for I will bring peace upon the princes.
Notice it doesn't say the mighty God, or the everlasting father in the original scripture.
Also matt 28 v 19 is at odds with acts 2 v 38, something fishy ( pun intended for dagons sun worshipping catholics, we know it was you😢)goin on here!
All praise YHWH and his only begotten Son YAHSHUA
1 GOD, 1 SON, 1 SPIRIT

[cleitondecarvalho]

the gratest problem is teaching it as fact when it has csome flows.

[grwaitemd]

Ellen White was a pioneer of the SDA Church. Though Ellen White did not mention the trinity as it relates to the divinity of Christ, she wrote about the divinity of Christ many times. She never wrote that His divinity was based on a co-eternal existence or co-natural immortality. She always based Christ's divinity on His sonship with His Father who is the only true God.