Is the Calvinist God the author of evil? w/ William Lane Craig

[OkieAllDay]

Calvinism:
* Makes God the author of sin
* Teaches that Jesus didn't die for everyone
* Teaches that God does not love everyone
* Teaches that God does not want everyone to be saved
* Removes free will (we are all just robots following the program got installed... they hate that terminology, but that's what it is)

[robertwaller-mcpb]

The problem with Calvinism is it negates free will.

[matthewoburke]

I love this because it really highlights that with Calvinism, you can't "appeal to mystery." There's no way around this! With Calvinism the only logical conclusion is that God is the author of evil.

[TheMOV]

In my experience Calvinists sometimes say, to points like this, “No, that’s a complete misunderstanding” There then follows a rather wordy explanation which. when you summarise it, completely bears out the original point.

[toughbiblepassages]

oh my goodness Craig.. you are smarter than this 😑

Calvin did not teach God positively caused anyone to sin. Calvinists believe that God may choose not to interfere to stop someone from sinning, but that’s the same thing you believe.

[southpawhammer]

This is what happens when you demand an explanation for absolutely everything.

[AndroidDigest]

This is just silly. Even an Arminian should believe God has the full power to stop any evil. And when God decides to allow something to happen, with all power to stop it, that's the same exact thing. It doesn't mean God is the author of evil. And Calvinism doesn't teach that either. Per the scriptures there were SEVERAL TIMES God intentionally overrode people's wills..or even used evil things for His purposes.

The bottom line: God is in control of all things, God can do whatever He pleases, but God, when allowing evil, He is using the evil of man to accomplish His purposes. He isn't creating evil. It is the evil of men in their hearts, God is simply using it for good.

God may determine what happens, but He uses men, at His discretion, in that determination. He is sovereign men are responsible. He gave Adam and Eve free will. They brought sin into the world. God allowed it, yes, but at that point, it is man that had sin, man that chose sin. God simply uses the evil of man and either restrains it or redirects it, He doesn't create it, He uses it for good. That's real Calvinism

[taylor-gqrg]

I'm surprised at Dr Craig's narrow-mindedness here. To jump straight from "God causes evil people to do evil they do, therefore God is evil." This is disingenuous because God causing people who are already evil to do the evil they do is only one thing God does, and there's a very good reason for him doing that one thing. God has done many things that would be evil for us to do, but it's good for him to do because it brings about his purposes, which are always good. Therefore, the God who causes already evil people to do evil to carry out an ultimate purpose that is infinitely good, the kingdom of heaven, is infinitely good, therefore the God of Calvinism is not the author of evil, but the proprietor of the good. Thank you.

[joshuacrager]

I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things. Isaiah 45:7

Shall the trumpet be blown in a city, and the people not be afraid? shalt evil befall a city, and the LORD hath not done it? Amos 3:6

[donaldjoy]

Many people hate Calvinism and Calvinists so much that they'll deny scripture, deny the fact that God uses evil for His own glorious purposes, deny Isaiah 45:7, etc. Yes, God is the author of everything, including evil, so what? That doesn’t mean God is evil, it means God is totalitarian, and many people just need to get over it.

[pguiseppe]

No it’s not that God controls every act that a human does but it is that His will comes to pass regardless what we do. That is The God we serve.

[timffoster]

Gen 50;20
Judges 14
Isaiah 10
Jeremiah 51
Exodus 4:21-23
Acts 4:27-28
Jeremiah 19:9
Rev 17:17
Job 1:20-21

What say you, WLC? These verses depict God as the Person who moves/commands/sends the person to do things that are evil for that person to do.

(those verses are off the top of my head. forgive me if i bungled the exact reference)

[karltiedemann]

I TImothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of ALL men, specially of those that believe.

[donaldjoy]

Well, there's really no getting around the fact that God, being all-powerful, at least allows evil to exist, when He could erase it, prevent it, etc. So yes, He is the author of evil, for His ultimately glorious purposes. Isaiah 45:7, in many translations, even has Him saying, "I create evil."

[gracearmor]

"What is the unbeliever rejecting? If Calvinism is true, then the unbeliever is rejecting a God who doesn't love or provide for them. They are rejecting a God who first rejected them and created them for wrath. Who wouldn't reject that? You must start with the biblical teaching of God's love and provision for all people to present an accurate view of the gospel. Otherwise, people may think they aren't really loved or provided for when in reality they are. If they reject the gospel, they are rejecting a God who genuinely loves and provides for them."
- Leighton Flowers

[TheMOV]

I'm having a conversation at the moment with a friend of mine who is very convinced about irresistable grace and unconditional election, because I heard him preach a sermon last Sunday, in which he was pleading with people who were not Christians, to "not resist God because if you keep on resisting him, the point will come when it's too late" - Is it possible that his heart is telling him something that his theology doesn't agree with?

[DerrekGarcia]

Calvinism is basically a trinitarian version of Zoroastrianism, it puts good and evil on the same playing field and deifies both.

[LilShredd]

Calvinists try too hard to understand everything about God. But God is bigger than us, and we're not supposed to understand everything about Him. We just have to accept that.

[AndrewWilson-oljb]

To be fair to Calvin's position on this, Calvin would say that in some ways God *is* the author of evil but that any human action that is evil and preordained is not evil in a cosmic sense because God's purpose for the event is good. A parent may imprison their child in a room or force them into an uncomfortable situation if it is for their ultimate good, though this is a woefully meek example. For example, God ordained Joseph's brothers to sell him into slavery (an evil action), but as we see in Gen. 50:20: "As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good, to bring it about that many people should be kept alive, as they are today." Other examples might include divine punishments through the Assyrians and Babylonians and Pharaoh's refusal to let the Israelites go. All of these were ordained by God, through evil men. In the NT, you could see the imprisonment of Paul, who is then able to convert the jailer and his family. These actions are evil from men, but they are ordained by God and for His purposes. If we claim to believe in God's sovereignty (ie Acts 4:24, 1 Tim. 6:15) this is what sovereignty means: full control. We also need to remember that God judges man, not the other way around. God is the very definition of good, so we should adjust our moral compass to God's, not try to make him fit our moral standards.

[josephwolcott]

Most anti-Calvinists genuinely don't understand Calvinism and Reformed thought. People like Craig only know the straw man of Calvinism presented by anti-Calvinists. If you read Calvinist sources you would know that it does not make God the author of evil. Read Book 2 of Calvin's Institutes, Chapter 5-6 of the Westminster Confession of Faith, Articles 13-17 of the Belgic Confession, and the Canons of Dort. I'll post the links in a separate comment below because I've tried to comment this two times already, and I want to know if they disappeared because Reason & Theology doesn't want people to know what Calvinists actually believe, or YouTube didn't like that I included links in my comment, or if it was flagged by a rabid anti-Calvinist. We'll see. Links to sources to follow.