Atheistic Determinism and Theological Determinism is there a difference? Response to John Lennox.

We looked a bit at John Lennox’s comments on John 6, but will continue that more in-depth on a future Radio Free Geneva.

#Philosophy #JohnLennox #Will

[edwardelliott]

Thanks Pastor James. This reminds of the youth pastor at a church I used to go to. His sermon was on Mathew 24 putting a heavy Dispensational spin on it. He went verse by verse and read them all - except one. Mathew 24:34 “Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place”. That verse and the similar one in Mark destroy dispensationalism to my mind.

[davevandervelde]

Wow. As I see this more and more clearly, I also see that your ability to lay this out biblically is really a blessing to us. Thank you.

[ryangallmeier]

Indeed, James is absolutely correct: in naturalistic/materialistic determinism there is NO Teleological Principle (no "Purpose Principle"). At least not one that anyone can ascertain without simply speculating.
In Divine, Decisional, Decretal Determinism, revealed in Scripture, there is absolutely a Teleological Principle!
For example, SOLI DEO GLORIA is the ultimate purpose of God in all that He does, has done, and will do.  
God's self-exaltation is of primary importance to Him...and it should be for His people as well.

*Soli Deo Gloria*

[naturalisted]

EPH. 1:11, [God] works ALL things according to the council of His own will.

[Thinking-Biblically]

I have a question if anyone out there can answer it on the side of John Lennox. He is basically saying God would not tell you to do something or command you to do something that you are not able to do correct? Does God command you to obey the Ten Commandments? Or to be holy as he is Holy or to be perfect as he is perfect? Can you do any of that? Why would he ever tell you to do stuff that you can't in and of yourself do? Think about it

[IdolKiller]

It's interesting to see how James now sees it as fatalistic after having defended theistic determinism for so many years.

[dw]

A robot plays a role.
But is that what Dr. Lennox was referring too when he made that statement?

Surely Dr. Lennox knows both in and out of Determinism - a computer, a machine, a car, a robot, play a role.
I suspect his words were taken out of context - because otherwise he's making a statement any high-school philosophy student would know is FALSE.

[noahrombold]

2 Timothy 2:21 KJV — If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

[gigahorse]

I think Dr. White misunderstood the Adam example. Dr. Lennox wasn’t saying that Adam’s hiding was an example of us choosing God, but that Adam verbally responding to God’s call is an example.

[donhaddix]

if you deny freewill why are you trying to change people's minds? talk about contradiction!

[pierceostrander]

You don't actually advance a counter-argument: you simple make appeals to authority. Weak minded. Compatibilism is non-sensical on the surface - you need to take one position or the other. Either your God is an evil ogre or he isn't. Be a man, take a position. "Go read everything else I, or the authorities I rely on have ever said and understand it the way I do" is not an argument.

[Liberty-LLama]

You're right. Theistic determinism is way worse than atheistic determinism.

[Thinking-Biblically]

James White needs to repent of that sweater LOL. Love you James!! Thank you

[donhaddix]

Calvinists, what you are chosen for hell?

[jamiejame]

JW is caught up in his OWN tradition. Something he accuses of others. Laughable.