An Orthodox Priest and Catholic Apologist Talk about the Papacy

In this video, Orthodox priest, Fr. Laurent Cleenewerck, and Catholic Apologist, Erick Ybarra, discuss the papacy. However, this isn't your usual battle of proof texts. Instead, we dive deep into questions of ecclesiology which get to the root of the disagreement between Catholics and Orthodox. Throughout the course of the discussion, Fr. Laurent and Erick tackle questions like:
1. Did Catholics and Orthodox EVER agree on the papacy?
2. What does Roman primacy mean?
3. What can we learn from the Council of Serdica?
4. When does papal primacy turn into papal supremacy?
5. What's the nature of the Church?

Fr Laurent Cleenewerck is an Orthodox priest serving as rector of St Innocent Orthodox Church in Eureka, California, in the Orthodox Church in America diocese of the West. He is among other things a graduate of the St Sergius Institute in Paris and current teaches theology for the Ukrainian Catholic University and for Euclid University. He is the author of His Broken Body: Understanding and Healing the Schism between the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches, and the editor of the Eastern/Greek Orthodox New Testament.

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Gospel Simplicity began as a YouTube channel in a Moody Bible Institute dorm. It was born out of the central conviction that the gospel is really good news, and I wanted to share that with as many people as possible. The channel has grown and changed over time, but that central conviction has never changed. Today, we make content around biblical and theological topics, often interacting with people from across the Christian tradition with the hope of seeking greater unity and introducing people to the beautiful simplicity and transformative power of the gospel, the good news about Jesus.

About the host:

How I made the coffee in the video:

Video Stuff:
Camera: Sony a6300
Edited in FCPX

Music:
Bowmans Root - Isaac Joel
YODRSIYIVB5B6QPM

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Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction
01:06 - Did the East and West ever agree?
14:40 - What do we mean by Roman primacy?
01:03:00 - What makes a church a church?
01:20:40 - Where's the line between primacy and infallibility?

[mayilla]

I really liked how civil this was. Wish there were more discussions like this between Catholics and Orthodox.

[jakajakos]

Very respectful and charitable discussion. I wish this would become the norm in conversations among Christians

[BrotherLaymanPaul]

Father Laurent is my confessor. A wonderful man, diligent priest, and faithful servant of God! ❤
Thanks for hosting this chat, Austin! May God bless your journey.

[mjramirez]

Erick Ybarra, a very nice, gentle Cuban and a very knowledgeable Catholic apologist. A gift to the Church. Love to the Orthobros by the way ☺

[milagroman]

Former RC here, EO catechumen (to be received soon). Sort of "double checking" that I'm making the right decision. Although I don't always agree with Ybarra, I wish there were more popular internet apologists like him. Catholics use this word too often sometimes...but I will say, Erick is the king of charity. Most charitable guy online in this sphere. We would all get so much further in our spiritual lives together if we loved one another in discussion like Erick does.

Although I'm pretty sure I'm going to follow through on this and become Eastern Orthodox, I will always remember Mr. Ybarra as a shining example of being diplomatic, stern yet polite, and loving in his speech. He never talks just to hear his own voice, and he is also an astounding active listener.

[mertonhirsch]

My dad was an Anglican priest who left that church with the acceptance of female priests in the mid 70s and the moves to accept homosexuality. He became an Orthodox priest instead of a Roman Catholic priest because he believed that Vatican II indicated the potential for the Roman Catholic Church to ordain women or bless homosexual marriages "within 50 years." It's interesting to me to look back and see that it wasn't the filioque, or infallibility, but the potential for liberalization that he saw in Vatican II.

[roslicornaggia]

Erick Ybarra is so clear and factual and he speaks so humbly.
Im so honored to have been born into the Catholic Church.
Praise our Precious Lord ❤️🙏🔥🙏❤️

[iliya]

I always appreciated Erick’s candid and respectful approach. Fr Laurent Cleenewerck was highly influential on me in my conversion from Catholicism to Orthodoxy. Very thankful for his great work on ecclesiology and in helping me understand the more ancient Petrine and Eucharistic ecclesiology of the Church. “There is only one bishop in the catholic Church.” ☦️

[briandelaney]

I’m
Orthodox but I have nothing but love for the Church of my heritage which is the Catholic Church. I hate the online polemics between apologists for both

[confectionarysound]

I really enjoyed Fr. Laurent last time you had him on. I think this will be a cordial and productive discussion.

[lannyrayconnelljr]

I was just baptized into the Orthodox Church last Saturday. I considered Catholicism for a while but Orthodoxy just made more sense.

I’m looking forward to seeing it!

[PeterBalaskas-qp]

As a devote Catholic from birth, I am 79 years old, I needed at some point in my life to look deeper into the faiith, so in my search I have deepened my love for the Almighty God by learning about the other Universal Churches...The Syriac Church and it's Saints sent a burning desire in my heart and soul that has deepened my love of My God, My Father, My Savior. I since had to rethink things. I believe in Peter the first Bishop of Rome, with all the love and respect for this belief....But something tugged at me. Every human being is stained with the weakness of sin...If there is total power, there is total corruption which leads to the total destruction of the Church...if a local Bishop is corrupt, then we have "death" in a local area, not the destruction of the total Faith, but the birth of spiritual warriors to defend the faith....Total control of any spiritual or earthly structure by mortal humans is an opening for the forces against God to corrupt...sorry to say that this is true throughout Church history but we need the other 2 Catholic branches to keep this from happening...ABSOLUTE POWER CORRUPTS ABSOLUTELY....THE ROOTS ARE SIMPLE IN THE DESERT FATHERS AND ALL THOSE THAT DID NOT STRAY FROM THE VERY FOUNDATION OF THE FAITH, PURIFYING OUR HEARTS WITH PURE LOVE FOR OUR GOD, OUR FATHER AND SAVIOR

[NicoFTWandMichael]

I'm a Catholic, and I want to say that I love and respect very much my Orthodox brethren. I encourage my side to pray and fast for their salvation, conversion, protection, guidance and many spiritual and temporal blessings in their lives. That's what love is about, willing the good of the other! P.S. not only for them, but for all men who are either linked to us by baptism or not, He loved all men, so must we. But it is well from time to time in prayer to also specify intentions for whom.

[daysihall]

I’ve always wondered what a conversation between Erik Ybarra and Father Stephen De Young would be like? 😅

[terrorists-are-among-us]

The Orthodox priest was so knowledgeable and respectful 😍

[stephenchelius]

Loved the discussion on the petrine and complete aspects of local churches, how that relates to the whole, etc. Ecclesiology is so beautiful. The talk about the local church as the "cell" within the body. There seems to be such depths to plumb when we think about the Church in these aspects: the body of Christ, the Petrine aspect, the Mariological aspect, the family of God, the temple of God, and on and on...

[rhwinner]

Thank you for hosting this very important discussion. I see a lot of criticism from the Orthodox side toward Catholicism online, much more than I see criticism directed in the other direction, but I love my Eastern bros and sisters with a fraternal love that will not be quenched even by rebuff.

[minasoliman]

Love the choice of the individuals for this discussion, both of whom wrote excellent books on this topic and both of whom are very respectful and civil in their demeanor showing the love of Christ to one another even when in disagreement. Would love to see more of both of them having these excellent dialogues together.

[joolz]

Also Austin-you are amazing. God has ordained you to this great ministry!
You are needed.
God wants unity!

You are working for Him here trying to accomplish this!

Didn’t Jesus say who is for us is not against us?

Like, when the disciples said that somebody else was healing, in the name of Jesus?

I think that applies here in actuality.
We humans are all wrong…

God bless you Austin.
You are so calm and fair!

A good example for me.

PS..Our goal is to unite ourselves with Jesus Christ.

If we could do it through any particular church, then I think He simply just wants that.

[marlamay]

I can't wait! I'll be getting my popcorn ready