Free Will vs. God's Plan | Belief It Or Not

How can we have free will if there is a plan for our lives?

Created by Trevor Poelman

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[landonksmith]

“They want obedience and freedom is just the marketing tool, ” that is a fantastic line

[Vapourwear]

The realization that "everything good about me is 'god, ' and everything bad about me is me" was a big part of me dropping out...that's some fucked-up, abusive shit, right there.

[ReasonQuest]

"So true freedom is doing what you're told, and liking it." SPOT ON! That's exactly what evangelicals believe.

[shecklesmack]

They want to give God all of the credit with none of the responsibility. It’s actually a massive, obvious contradiction.

[FiniteMan]

There's nothing I hate more than when I succeed in something or pass a test really well and then my mom trying to congratulate me says "God is good" or "Thankfully I prayed" although I understand it's in a good faith it just makes me angry. It's like all the hardwork and time I PUT IN was pointless and it was all because of an apparent God, it's kind of like seeing a good athlete and saying they are good purely because they are talented which sort of invalidates all the sweat and blood they put into getting this good.

[averagefanenjoyer]

When evangelicals say "freedom" what they really mean is "freedom from sin". Which means doing everything they say, being a slave to their religion, the total opposite of freedom.

[JordyMOOcow]

In the Christian heaven, you have no free will. As a child I was told heaven's like a never-ending church service where we all lose our personalities and connections to one another (no moms, dads, families, everyone's a child of god which is why we call everyone brother and sister on earth?) And you never want to leave that church or do anything else. And to me, that sounded absolutely terrifying and a like a living hell ironically.

[MogamiKyoko]

Nothing made me more angry than when people told me at my dad's funeral when I was 12 that it was "part of God's plan." If people's deaths are somehow in the interest of "God's plan, " then I want absolutely nothing to do with a religion that worships him. That's beyond effed up and why do people think that's an okay thing to say to a child. Wow, good job, you've exercised your free will to twist the knife deeper for a child who just lost her father, way to go. The thought gymnastics one has to go through to believe in both free will *and* are clearly insane.

[NerdFiction]

One of the things that helped deprogram me most as I was questioning my faith was the exact opposite of this. I kept begging God to show me that I was on the wrong path by throwing up road blocks while I was questioning things, to punish me for my sinful (read: queer) behavior and lead me to damnation for partaking in drugs. Instead every step I took I just kept seeing more "blessings" rain down upon me. A stable career in entertainment, falling in love with the person of my dreams, buying a house and having two amazing cats and getting to travel so much and currently working on a feature film that is looking like it will be in theaters. My life has gone from constant depression and suicidal ideation, to being so amazing that I suffer frequent guilt for what I have that others don't.

The person I am without the awful weight of christianity hanging over me means I actually want to live now. It's a very strange thing to feel like you're just starting your life in your 30s, and it can feel daunting inside of the change because transitions are always hard. But I wouldn't trade my life now for anything. I still am a bit pessimistic towards the world and how we treat each other, but for the first time ever I actually am concerned about my own mortality. I realize the rare and brief opportunity we have in life and I don't want to be someone who squanders what can be absolutely beautiful especially when I've been so lucky to find myself in as fortunate of a position as I am. And if God wanted to stop me from losing all faith all he had to do was what he does to billions across the world.

[lisapeesalemonsqueezah]

What I was taught in church is that the freedom we get through Christ is not about freedom on earth, it’s freedom in heaven because everyone else is essentially incarcerated after the Rapture.

So when I asked “why is God punishing those that couldn’t figure out that Jesus and the bible is the truth? Especially GOOD people who are only trying their best to make sense of the universe.” They told me he’s not. They said that h=ll is not a punishment for not becoming Christian, it’s a punishment for our sin and being Christian is what saves us from our sin.

But as an adult I thought, then why make those people? He’s putting them in a pretty unfair position. None of us asked to be born, none of us consented to this contract and very few of us even had the terms of the contract explained to us. Even people like myself who grew up in Christianity can’t be sure that the people who explained our life’s terms of agreement, know what they’re talking about. Especially when there are many other people with totally different books saying the same thing: “this book says it’s true! So it must be! All the other books are wrong, you must believe ONLY this one!”

I feel like this doesn’t demonstrate a loving, caring God. I feel like it’s just a narcissist manipulating us into thinking that he’s not saying “love and praise me or suffer” when he definitely is.

[jamesnurgle]

there was a quote from someone in an old German youth group that went something like "he gave us freedom from freedom" and this really reminds me of that.

[starshine]

i was told the abuse i experienced as a child (i have a trauma disorder because of it) was because god had a plan for me and it was preparing me for worse than what i was experiencing. i was basically told that gods plan for my life was severe abuse and i was meant to endure it.

[doing_aok]

to me, this is the most insidious tactic of the church. i was told my whole life that there was plan for me, but i had to find it and be damned if i didn’t. once i left, i was terrified. i still feel like there is Something i’m supposed to be doing. every career, life, relationship choice feels like a guess at the right answer EVEN WHEN I DONT BELEIVE IN IT ANYMORE. but the church tells you it has the answer, it’ll help you find it keeping you sucked in and isolated

[DoggishPrince]

This is probably the discussion I’ve had the most with my religious friends. It’s a hard topic to talk on so thank you for speaking in it. It is my favorite part about theology

[BlackCover]

Your introduction reminds me of the time Ben was talking about Satan in _Paradise Lost_ . He starts by saying that the reason Satan rebelled was out to valuing personal autonomy. As he’s explaining this, he abruptly stops that thought mid-sentence and suddenly starts claiming the reason Satan rebelled was because he didn’t want to do good things.

[katherineg]

When i started listening to apologists and Christians talk about Christianity I was shocked at what I was hearing; there was so much control, especially about what you could think. As a lifelong atheist i knew i was free to let my mind go wherever it wanted to go. A lot of Christians dont even realize how much freedom they don't have. I was very glad to be an atheist because my mind belonged to me and only me.

[corvididaecorax]

For the Birthday Problem, it isn’t that if there are 23 people there is a 50% chance of someone having the same birthday as you. It is a 50% chance of some two people in that group sharing the same birthday. It is much less likely to be you in particular.

[hasone]

Trevor, It was gods will for this video to show up on YouTube today for me to watch (doesn't matter the fact that I'm subscribed and have the notifications on). But I totally used my free will to watch it!! Thank you for the great content!!

[DimaRakesah]

I have also noticed that among the hyper religious, love is control. If you love someone, you control them. For their own good, of course. Even if it means abusing them, as long as you're trying to save their immortal soul or whatever, it's "love".

[annjepsen]

I can't tell you how much I love and appreciate this channel. I was raised in the Evangelical Christian church and as a child I was constantly causing problems at church. I'm autistic (I wasn't diagnosed until last year since I was very good at masking) and my strong moral compass caused me to speak out against the constant contradictions that are present in Christianity. Adults don't know how to react when a 8 year old calls out the white-washing of Jesus Christ a person. I was kind of "kicked out" of Sunday School for saying that the God my Sunday school teacher described isn't a god worth worshipping. The story of Abraham and Issac is what pushed me over the edge. When I was told the story it was obvious that I'm supposed to admire Abraham's unwavering faith in God, and since God stopped Abe short of killing Issac, we're not supposed to be bothered by God's request.
I realize a few years ago that growing up in the church caused me a lot of trauma and your videos have helped me in deconstructing my past. Thank you so much for your videos!!❤❤❤