Why Divine Foreknowledge Is Such a Problem

Here, I discuss why full divine foreknowledge of future events is such a problem for theists who believe in it.

[ATipplingPhilosopher]

Massive thanks to Justus and all the kind contributors (Chindi, Doc, Mitch). Very generous indeed.

[enaroos]

Thank for another great video. Never get tired of listening to the divine foreknowledge argument. Didn't see a way to superchat but will buy you coffee instead.😊

[dustinellerbe]

The movie Saw reminds me of the situation a God would put us in. Every move one makes in the scenario had a consequence. A consequence the non omni creator of the scenario knew would happen depending on the actions one took.

Great show, as always my friend.

[johnnehrich]

"God is love" CAN be true if it all about god - he has omni love for HIMSELF, and only cares about you if you love him first - the old testament is basically filled with story after story about how god expects you to love him, no matter what he does to you. (Ask Job, for instance.)

[TheMirabillis]

Jonathan,

I agree with the points or issues you raised regarding free will. In your opinion, why wouldn’t Apologists ( like William Lane Craig ) agree with you on your points ? Do you think those Apologists would not understand those points or issues regarding free will or they would understand them but just ignore them ( because they are dishonest ) ?

[dustinellerbe]

"He gets to poke Jonathan" 🤣🤣

I knew you were the MESSIAH! The great God man king messiah lord

[markc]

I think the biggest problem for open theism is that it doesn’t fit with our best science. Given relativity, there is no universal present - what to me is future could be past to someone else, given that even simultaneity is relative. It’s quite plausible that there is no ontological distinction between past, present, and future. If that’s the case, either God fits somewhere in space and time and is not omniscient since he doesn’t know something that should be knowable (the future exists, so if he doesn’t know it he has epistemic limitations - I take it open theists claim that since the future doesn’t exist yet it’s not knowable). Or God exists outside of space and time and can see the whole thing.

[steveng.clinard]

I disagree a bit with the teacher's test scenario. Regardless of whether the teacher knows to result in advance, there is value in demonstrating to the student an objective measure of their knowledge. The Dunnimg-Krueger effect holds that many students with poor mastery will greatly over-estimate their own mastery, and some students with excellent mastery will underestimate their own mastery. I suppose much depends on how one feels about whether we care if those suffering eternal torment understand why or not. It's pretty fucked up no matter how you slice it.

[steveng.clinard]

re: heaven and hell, per standard Christian theology, it doesn't matter how good or bad your behavior was, but rather whether you accepted salvation through Jesus at the time of your death. God doesn't give a shit about what you do but only whether you are kissing his ass when you buy the farm.

[dmckenzie]

If god was able to experience things just by imagining them rather than actually creating them wouldn't imagining suffering preclude that god from being all loving? The whole story is patently absurd anyway. Sorry I missed the live it was a bit early for me in Washington state .

[toddoman]

Interesting video but I feel the need to challenge you on a few things as a theist. To start with you have this philosophical opinion of the God of the bible based off of a very distorted understanding of the text. There is no hell, no satan and no Adam and Eve as the first humans in the bible. Since you already don't believe in any of that to start with can we just both agree that those are facts. It also appears you think of "God" as some sort of human type entity, questioning if he/it has "free will". I think that sort of framing of the concept of God can be very distorting. To think of God who would exist eternally outside of space and time as making decisions. It reminds me of the question can God create a stone so big even he can't lift it? On the surface it seems like a paradox but in reality it is simply an illogical question.