8 Worst Antagonist Mistakes New Fantasy Writers Make

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00:00 Introduction
00:47 Mistake 1
02:22 Mistake 2
03:57 Mistake 3
05:37 Mistake 4
07:09 Mistake 5
08:38 Mistake 6
10:07 Mistake 7
11:28 Mistake 8

[richardrahl]

We should also not confuse an antagonist with a villain.
Antagonists are necessary for the plot. Villains are not. What is more impactful for one’s story, or which they want to write is up to them.

[AndrewFrancisIlyrian]

Joker is purely evil and has no background, but is an amazing villain.

[setofreakinkaiba]

When you mentioned unclear objectives, I thought about Hans from Frozen. The character kept changing, and it wasn't clear what he wanted until the plot twist at the end. The character is more fleshed out in the book that was made, and the reader can see more about his life and why he decided to do the things he did.

[NeoZhinzo]

I agree on some points, but very much disagree on others. Complex villains and subverting cliché tropes are not inherrently better than their counterparts. On the contrary, these practices have become overused tropes of their own. What matters more than wether your villain has layers to their personality is wether their actions, phillosophy, and/or goals stand in direct conflict with those of the protagonist.

Using an example from recent time, The Spot from Across the Spiderverse is a great villain not because of his depth of character, but because he is a simple powerful threat who has a personal grudge against the protagonist and his actions and goals, moreso than just being destructive, get in the way of Miles' goals. Wether intentionally or unintentionally.

Making him a deeper character than "you hit me with a bagel and turned me into a freak! I hate you now!" Might make him a better character, but unless done skillfully is just more likely to make him a more tedious character.

TL, DR: Character depth is an accent. Don't apply too heavily.

[Dragonmoon]

Agree on all points. And, when thinking of favorite antagonists, the morally gray ones are far more enjoyable.

I definitely need to expand my villans personalities.

In pushing through draft one I stuck to the basics for the whole cast. But, I relize how flat and one dimensional everyone is.
Before starting draft two I really need to do some character delving.😅

[Dragonmoon]

Artimes Enteri and Jarlaxle from R. A. Salvatore.

Dresden Files by Jim Butcher has a few, Nicodemus a fallen angel, John Marcone a mob boss, Queen Mab of the Winter Court.

Generally, as you pointed out, villans that aren't cut and dry "evil" but have a moral code. Twisted and very gray, but moral.

[josephamstutz]

Favorite is gotta be Darth Vader. Everyone in the Star Wars Galaxy fears him, even Palpatine to some extent.

[KajtekBeary]

I think having reasonable and deep motivations and not being pure evil are two different things. IMO pure evil characters can be interesting, if their character is logical.

For example, Blackbeard or Imu from One Piece both can be described as two different variations of pure evil. They are imo both interesting because of the way Oda is using them.

One of them is a foil of Luffy, but he lacks luffy's morality and emotional intelligence. He is very unpredictable though. He has his ideas, his goals, which are, in a way, very similar to Luffy's, but when Luffy is pursuing his dreams by helping others pursue theirs, Blackbeard's approach is completly selfish. It's an interesting dichotomy. Both of them grow at the same time, both of them shake the world. Blackbeard is in a way an Anti-Protagonist of the story.

Imu on the other hand is a personification of both mystery and darkness of the world. It was shown time and time again how sickening this world is. Imu is used in a way to be a figurative avatar of this darkness. He is a face that allows readers to see that all of those tragedies weren't just caused by situation that couldn't be avoided. They were results of decisions of de facto one individual. They do not need to be complex themself, they don't even need to be present. They are just a way to give the world, which is a true antagonist of this story, a face. And this makes them compeling.

[TheTaleTinkerer]

What / Who are your favorite antagonists of all time? :)

[hadeshades]

Sychus followed the path of destruction. His elite bodyguard hastily maintaining the formation around him. They all were crept out and twitchy. Every step resulting in bone giving way under their weight. They came to the quarters of the head of logistics. The corpses of the head logistics secretary’s were burned like the small army trying to defend their lord. The door seemed unturned. The scorching marks magically stopped at the door. “Lord commander, ” one of the guards asked, “how do we proceed?” “If there is any chance the lord of logistics still lives we need to find him quickly. So just open that blood door!”, Sychus responded and added more thoughtfully, “if I we not been so short supply we could focus on staging the attack on the planet.” The door exploded outward. It took him a while to recover, and noticed halfway through Landa had taken the full brunt of shrapnel. The guards in front of him slowly formed red lakes on the ground. He grabbed Landa. As he turned her over he new there was no saving her. To preoccupied with trying to help his live long friend he didn’t notice that the remaining guards had started suppressing fire into the room. He only let go of her when one of the remaining guards lifted him up and dragged him out of the immediate danger zone. The guards tried speaking to him but his ears were still ringing. The guard got more and more nervous. Yelling and shouting. Sychus snapped back, stood, and saw bones flying. He was alone. Heart racing he turned the corner and fell over backwards. The traitors gun had bumped into his face as he turned the corner. The logistics officer said calmly, “you will not exploit the population.” he paused for a moment, “and tell the story.” Before nodding to someone Sychus couldn’t see. He saw the weapons effect at work as the logistics officers ignited, turned into ashes and bone, raining down on him. What came his way then was indescribable. The ashes in his eyes didn’t help as it slowly began to disappear.
The captain was not exactly pleased with his performance. Sychus was sure that the captain wanted to get rid of “the guests” as he called it, before transition.
The captain ordered a full search of the ship. It was clear that this attack was the last nail in the coffin for their supply. There would e no more until a new logistics team was established.

[als]

Here is a question based on these mistakes. What if the antagonist is not the main antagonist? What if the main antagonist is a force of nature (Let's say the main antagonist that pushes the plot is the civil war currently surrounding the characters) Since they are not the one who is the main drive, yet they stand in the way of the person how does that influence them when it comes to these. Because some of these mistakes wouldn't fit a secondary antagonist considering how much must be spent on the force of nature antagonist.

[Battleguild]

The current main Antagonist I'm working with suffers from various birth defects and whose innate magical strength is often considered on the weaker side by the magic community, mostly because of its lack of power to brute force solutions compared to the other magics. The Antagonist is indebted to the true Villain of the story, as they were the only one who accepted them as they were.

The Antagonist presents a threat to the Protagonist through their mastery of Alchemy, Artificing, and Enchanting that they have acquired over their prolonged life. Their deep involvement in the formation of the current magic society offers them access to rare resources and vast networks of political influence.

Their objective is to revive the Villain back into the world and reap vengeance against those who killed his only true friend. In order for his plan to work, he has to break the Six Great Seals of the world that were placed by the gods, in order to release those who he wishes to take revenge upon.

The Protagonist suffers the misfortune of being one of the keystones required to break one of the Six Great Seals, as their innate magic links them to one the prisoners. Their failure in the hero's journey will not only result in their death, but also the collapse of the known world and the enslavement of both gods and mortals alike by the Villain.

[Senovitj]

What if the antagonist is a god, where the characters have little possibility to gain insight into its true motives?