The Fall Of The Eleventh Legion - 40K Theories

For as long as anyone can remember, the second and eleventh legions of the Legiones Astartes have remained something of a mystery to scholars, due to all information pertaining to them being erased from Imperial records. But has information regarding as to what became of both the eleventh legion and its mysterious Primarch finally come to light?

Featuring Haven Kendrick as Hastius Vychellan

Yohan Gasmask as Colquan

SuperAnchors as Rogal Dorn

Intro theme by Stringstorm

Additional audio editing by Officio Audiorum

Additional artwork by Genzoman, Disarmonia and L.J.Koh

All art property of their respective owners.

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[dondavenport]

What REALLY happened:
Russ: At long last, Malcador, I return to Terra after finishing my charge. Every member of the 11th legion has been eradicated.
Malcador: Um. You mean the 2nd, right?
Russ: No. The 11th. The [REDACTED].
Malcador: I sent you to exterminate the 2nd legion! Why did you destroy the 11th?
Russ: I have your orders right here! Look! Eliminate Legion 11!
Malcador: That's not an eleven. That's II. Two!
Russ: Oh... My bad. Do I still need to destroy the 2nd?
Malcador: Yes!
Russ: (Sigh). Ok. I'll be back.
Malcador: (Under his breath) I should have sent the Lion...
Russ: What was that?
Malcador: Nothing.

[ZIktheAlmighty]

In my head cannon, the 11th was too chummy with xenos, having landed on a world that had a thriving civ that was based on coexistence between humans and some other species . After reuniting with big E, he was promised his world and people would become part of the empire, and he went off to fight like a good boy. At some point coming back home to find it wiped out by one or more of the other legions, at the order of the Emperor. He didn't rebel or fall to chaos he just left, took his ship and what ever was left of his people and left the empire all together. Malcador and the Emperor simply couldn't let the others know that leaving was an option so, wipe their memories and pretend he did something so bad as to need to be erased for history.

[jadedkratos]

I miss these theory videos, I hope there are more theory videos like this coming in the near future. Would be really sweet if 40K Theories could clear up the inconsistencies there are in regards to Saul Tarvitz in the Horus Rising, False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Flight of the Eisenstein and Fulgrim novels. The inconsistencies are in regards to his Captaincy.

[maxy]

It's good to hear some of the TTS Voice actors voicing 40k characters again in all honesty

[guywholikesmemes]

Honestly I really like the idea lorgar was buds with the 11th primarch but after the "incident" he became absolutely shattered by it and it really fucked him up mentally, made even worse when big E inevitably went after him too for the whole worship thing.

[thatotherguy]

I like the idea that the 11th legion fell to mutation, that their gene-seed was unstable and eventually reached the point where the legion had to be purged - which is what caused Sanguinius to be afraid when Horus discovered him putting down one of his own mutated Astartes. And that other than that, the 11th was an all-around decent dude, which is why he's remembered fondly by his brothers. (with the notable exception of Dorn AFTER Malcador "unlocks" his memories... every other comment by the Primarchs is positive, Horus is willing to attack Malcador over destroying his statue, Robute leaves room for them at his table... yeah, I'm gonna trust Malcador is just "unlocking" Dorn's memories here... right...)

As for them being erased from history, my headcannon is that the Randgan were NOT Xenos, but were actually a potent group of Humans (who may or may not have been Mutants, but at the very least modified themselves in radical ways) who were able to rival the naecent Imperium. I think of them like the Ousters from the Dan Simmons Hyperion series, and I have the 2nd deciding that they were a better choice for Mankind than the Emperor - so he left the Imperium to join the Rangdan. Him alone, not his Legion or his Astartes. (some may or may not have decided to join him of their own free will) The 11th joined him to try to find a cure for himself and his Astartes, as the Randgan had far more experience with this kind of issue than the Emperor seemed to have. This, of course, is completely unacceptable for the Emperor so he ordered the Rangdan utterly destroyed.

Because neither then 2nd nor 11th actually TURNED on the Emperor, and both had good reasons for what they did (let's fact it, Emp's is a pretty nasty figure all told, and a lot of Primarchs were uncomfortable with massacring Humans who simply believed different things than what the Emperor believed), the other Primarchs held them in fairly high regard. But what they did was such a threat to the Emperor and Imperium that they had to be entirely written out. It's one thing to have an Enemy to Conquer, but it's entirely another thing to have a Peaceful Human Rival who might actually have a better idea than you. The first you can Defeat and gloat about, the second you have to entirely remove so no one gets the idea to recreate the Rival. That's why the "overreaction", and part of why the Traitors haven't been given the same treatment. (also, without the Emperor to actually to the Psychic manipulation, it's hard to do the same thing.)

[RaimoKangasniemi]

When the Emperor hasn't apparently even given up on Mortarion, and almost couldn't kill Horus, it would seem that the Emperor would have tried everything else before having the missing primarchs killed. So my uneducated bet would be for the primarch being imprisoned as proposed after 11:35. I also doubt that the Emperor would have allowed Malcador to have the primarchs' skulls as effectively trophies - that wouldn't be in character for either the Emperor or Malcador.

[rexlumontad]

10:46 Magnus The Red: "I PUNCHED OUT ONE OF LEMAN RUSS' HEARTS! WHY DOES NO ONE REMEMBER THAT?!"

[SirSpoon]

I think when the time is right, when all hopes seem lost, when things seem dire and at their worst, when GW really wants to try and make some fast cash they'll reveal the primarchs, their lore, and all the goodies they can sell with them.

[nonimport-ante]

remember just how powerful a psyker the emperor is. just because russ doesn't remember seeing a primarch die dosn't mean he hasn't. i can't remember exactly where it is but there is a moment where Russ remembers astartes killing each other before but can't recall where or when.

[khaimkrsu]

A resounding hurrah to you Remleiz!!! Good to see you dishing out lore!

[vontheunknown]

I mostly think the 11th Primarch is on Terra being held in the emperor palace deep away from anyone.

[Lumen_Obscurum]

I suspect the two chambers may indeed house the Lost Primarchs, but I wonder if one of them is in fact a Perpetual that is more powerful in that fashion than any of the other Primarchs. It would explain why Leman Russ thought Primarchs were unkillable, because he executed the 11th Primarch only for him to immediately return to life. It is also entirely possible that one of the crimes committed was accidentally revealing the existence of Perpetuals as that in itself would have upset the Emperor's plans. Furthermore, that would explain Rogal Dorn's statement that if the Lost Primarchs were still present during the Heresy that all would be lost. A legion of Space Marines that are commanded by Perpetuals who were themselves betrayed by the Emperor would have completely thrown off the balance of the war.

As for the Second Legion, I believe their Primarch could have been a different kind of failure. It is entirely possible that the Second was in fact a Blank. If the Second was a Blank, the Second Legion could have been a failure purely because they didn't exhibit any traits which made them unique, as their anti-psyker presence was below even the weakest natural born Blank. This would also lead to them not developing camaraderie like other Legions, instead working together apart from other aspects of the Imperium. Furthermore, I suspect that the Blank Primarch would be a failure in the Emperor's eyes because without a powerful soul to drive the development of the Primarch's body it's entirely possible that they looked more akin to a standard human. Possibly they even resembled the Emperor more than any of the others, reminding him of the humanity he has shed while never able to experience it themselves. Given what we know of the Pariah Gene, it's entirely possible that the Emperor saw that even a touch of it was enough to weaken an entire Legion while also making it too dangerous for others to try to understand. I posit that the Second Primarch is also a Perpetual, but as their body is not relying on a Primarch soul to drive it to its full height and power it's more of a biological Perpetuality than the metaphysical Perpetuality exhibited by beings such as Vulkan.

It is entirely possible then, that each room contains the body of a Primarch that cannot die. One whose spirit cannot depart and another whose body is always alive.

[empireempire]

Beware the Alien, the Mutant, the Heretic:
The Primarch of the IInd was a diplomat, gentle and pensive as we know from quotes, a friend to Xenos. He worked to reconcile the Imperium with the Alien races. He failed, but in doing so nearly tore the Imperium apart.
The Primarch of the XIth was a mutant, a friend to the downtrodden genetic misfits in the Imperium. He championed their cause. He failed, but in doing so nearly tore the imperium apart.
Then there was Horus. The Heretic. He saw the emperor for what he was - a notorious, untrustworthy traitor. He worked to save all whom the Emperor would betray. He failed, but in doing so nearly tore the imperium apart.

[wos]

Since Horus holds the title of being the first (or at least main) Primarch to fall to chaos I've always figured that the 2nd and 11th Primarchs comitted the other two main sins of the Empire, xenoheresy and technoheresy.

It makes sense to me that they ended up on worlds that didn't conform to the Emperor's vision for humanity. One Primarch possibly landed on a world that was home to more than just humans and ended up rulling over a multi-species kingdom/empire while the other landed on a technologically advanced world where AI is the norm. The Emperor would have tried to convince them to forsake their heretical homelands and, upon failing to do so, ordered all memory of them and their worlds destroyed and the Primarchs themselves imprisioned so these heretical views wouldn't spread.

This would also explain why the skulls on Malcador's throne bear their numbers... Malcador basically founded the inquisition which is an organization dedicated to rooting out disenting worldviews within the Imperium and the 2nd and 11th are the perfect example of that mission, possibly even being the inspiration for Malcador to create the Inquisition in the first place.

[UltimateDeliciousPie]

One of my old theories about one of the lost Legions was this; each Primarch was given a specific purpose. What if one Primarch was to engage and fight the Gods of Chaos in the warp itself? Such was his devotion to the Emperor that he ascended into a warp being but was rejected by the Emperor, his name being Malal becoming Malice.

I did also want to tie this into the Legion of the Lost and Damned, but given the info we know, probably isn't true.

[rexlumontad]

The Eleventh Legion is probably absorbed by the Ultramarines which explained the massive swelling of numbers of new Astartes.

[cthulhupthagn]

Also, regarding to those rooms that Dorn finds, I always took that to mean that he had just come across essentially dorm rooms. Earlier books in the heresy had established that the emperor had created places for his people his soldiers his sons to stay after the war was over. It's reasonable to assume that the 11th and 12th Legions would have likewise had such rooms. And it's equally likely that these rooms unable to be repurposed would have been sealed up by the emperor

[unfortunateson]

8:20 I personally think that Dorn was referring to a possible relationship of the 2nd and 11th to Horus, Lorgar, or the other traitor legions as he never outright states that they did anything wrong.

Personally, my take on the matter is that the 2nd rejected the Emperor but didn’t turn to Chaos. Choosing instead to flee the galaxy entirely, attempting to take his legion with him to try and make it to Andromeda (unironically the vector that the Tyranids are coming from). Leeman Russ could have possibly tried and succeeded in intercepting them, slaying “The Lost”

Could “The Damned” refer to the “Legion of the Damned? Perhaps they did a mass ritual and somehow erased the legion from real space.

[legregio]

My guess: one of them was the "philosopher/historian" among the twenty; he analized the Imperial Truth and find it was a totalitarian ideology, destined to fail in the end, and tried to find a compromise solution, bringing the wrath of the Emperor who didn't tolerate deviations. The other landed in a space hulk and become part of a civilization that mixed humans and xenos. When the Emperor rebuked him for such allegiancies and tried to bring him back into the ranks, the primarch revealed he had access to an ancient alien device (maybe belonging to Necron or Old Ones) capable of predictring the future, and that showed him three possible futures: one where half of the primarchs rebelled to the Emperor and defeated him and the loyalists, one where the Emperor vanquishes the rebels at a high price, and a third where the rebellion is nipped in the bud and the Emperor succedes in his plans, and "...it was like watching three different versions of Hell, neither one better or worse than the others, only different".
So the two Primarchs vanish from imperial history, one of them dead or prisoner, buried in the depth of Terra, the other escaping from the war and the madness, Far from the Imperium and the Eye of Terror, in a fleet of generational ships, in search for greener pastures.