Dune: Can We Master Our Genes Like the Bene Gesserit?

I talked to a geneticist about the plausibility of the genetic manipulation used by the Bene Gesserit order in the world of Dune.

Comment and let me know what you think of this episode. Do you agree with Dr. Praggastis' score at the end? What would you have added to this conversation?

Chapters
[00:00:00] Intro
[00:05:55] Genetics in Science Fiction
[00:10:08] Eugenics
[00:19:38] Genetic Manipulation
[00:25:28] Cryptid Female Choice
[00:30:54] Genetic Memory
[00:38:31] Metabolism
[00:45:29] Uncanny Valley
[00:46:44] Dune Plot
[00:51:44] Survival of the Fittest
[00:58:38] Reality Check

#dune #benegesserit #geneticsexplained

[MappingtheArchetypes]

The weird thing with humans seeking improvement is that we don’t have a shared notion of what the “optimal state” is. What I mean is, something like prosthetics are meant to restore a missing limb because we have a rubric (having two limbs) as a standard to gauge improvement toward. With humanity in general improving, what standard do we use for “ideal?” I make this point in a video using the example of psychology -modern psychology struggles because what “optimal” psychology is changes as culture does (which is why the dsm is reissued periodically). I have an opinion on what the “ideal” is, but my point here is that the line you mention between playing god and general human improvement might be blurry because of our misconceptions and disagreements on what “god” actually is… meaning… a “god” is an ideal or standard of “perfection” and if we don’t share the same definition as a culture, that line will always be blurry; we can’t define “improvement” without a clearly defined ideal state.

[hallockstuart]

Glad to see more substantive and scientific discussions of Dune on this platform!

On the topic of Dr. Praggastis issue with the feasibility of the Bene Gesserit's program, Dune depicts an atavistic universe where the institutions of the Imperium have been entrenched for thousands of years, so maybe such a program is feasible. It would be interesting to hear further discussion on the theme of atavism from both a sociological and biological perspective.

[WallaceSpirit]

WONDERFUL conversation ! Thank you ! I love the fact that alligators can choose the sex of the baby base on body temperature... very fun fact :) Thank you!

[DuneSpice]

We’re going to need to takeover your channel…. Nothing but Dune!!! 😂

[pseudonymousbeing]

It’s funny how the philosophical and moral opinions you expressed here are so in line with Frank Herbert. Many times I thought you were quoting one of his books. Great discussion!

About the wacky specifics of Dune: I’ve heard people discuss the notion that XX and XY chromosomes could be related to Herbert’s delineation between the capabilities of different sexes in his universe, specifically regarding genetic memory. Nonsense or interesting?

About the sisterhood seeking to create the ultimate man, I think nobody has really tackled Herbert’s complicated ideas about the gender of his Kwisatz Haderach. In the book one of the most seemingly regressive parts has Paul say that the feminine force is the giving force and the masculine is the taking force. Itself that’s nowadays frowned upon, but Paul goes on to say he is neither and people seem to largely ignore this. Denis Villeneuve, director of the 2021 film, alludes to this when discussing casting Chalamet for his nuanced masculinity. Denis believes that Chalamet has more to him so Denis chose him specifically for his modern sense of masculinity that has in its touch his femininity too. Outwardly Paul is meant to be the patriarchal ultimate leader of the universe, but that’s not all he is. 

Inwardly all the mystical inner abilities of the Kwisatz Haderach are associated with the feminine in Dune, it all comes much easier to women. Letting men in on it is the ultimate difficult goal. To get more into this I’d need to discuss the full first and second book, and even parts of the third which I won’t right now. I need to reread them and think more about Paul’s sister too as she’s really the key to all of this. 

It’s not simply women trying to create the perfect man.