Are the Marian Dogmas Historically Credible?

Truth Unites exists to promote gospel assurance through theological depth.

Gavin Ortlund (PhD, Fuller Theological Seminary) serves as senior pastor of First Baptist Church of Ojai.

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00:00 The Bodily Assumption
5:34 Theotokos
07:50 The Immaculate Conception

[jamestrotter]

The biblical Mary would be appalled at the false teaching that is centered around her.

[danielhixon]

Not only is there (so far as I can find) little to no evidence in the earliest sources that the assumption actually happened, but the Roman Church - by making this a dogma and attaching anathemas to it - is in the strange position of accepting early fathers as saints who don’t believe this while at the same time anathematizing contemporary believers who also don’t believe this. It is a glaring inconsistency in the Church of Rome caused by over reach of authority.

[realDonaldMcElvy]

The Assumption of Mary is just that, an Assumption.

[natebozeman]

Thank you so much for your work, Gavin.

After Bertuzzi converted, I started looking into RC because I didn't know much about it, and they have very effective rhetorical talking points that make you feel icky about not being a Catholic.

Your work has almost single-handedly made me confident in my Protestantism, and I no longer have ecclesial anxiety. Truly, thank you.

[deesteven]

Becket is an extremely valuable brother in the Lord. God Bless him and yourself too, Gavin. Thanks for all of your work. Hope all is well!

[lazaruscomeforth]

Good work! The massive sudden increase in Marian piety at such a late date is a very important observation, especially in light of the high stakes it has for soteriology.

[palabraviva]

I “might” be the most appreciative of these teachings/ discussions about the RCC! Why? I have been a missionary in Mexico for 12 years and Catholicism reigns here but it looks so different here than in the USA… there’s witchcraft mixed in I’m some places.. they have a ton of saints and other things. It’s so sad, for the most part these people are so lost and have no idea. When we come into a village stepped in traditions of the RCC we most of the time get immediately persecuted.. those who accept the gospel and start studying the Bible etc. get ram out of their villages sometimes.. get their water and electricity taken away and even sometimes killed by the Catholics.. it’s a mess! So I’m super grateful for these videos and will use them… sure wish they were in Spanish too

[coolmuso]

I love how the anathema says that those who reject the dogma “will incur the wrath of Almighty God and of the Blessed Apostles Peter and Paul.” You’d think that if you incur the wrath of God that would be sufficient, right? 😆 It’s just more Roman nonsense that detracts from even God’s very own wrath. Even that isn’t sufficient…

[ExNihiloNihilFit]

The 5-6 hour rebuttal at 3 AM incoming.

[CamGaylorMusic]

I think for people such as myself we crave tradition but at the same time crave truth. Tradition without truth is nothing. I have a very hard time worshipping in a modern evangelical church. I’ve tried it. For me confessional Lutheranism is the only place I’ve felt comfortable. It’s not perfect but it seems better to me then the other options I’ve come across. I always learn from your videos Gavin. Romans Catholics have tradition but they also have a lot of baggage that I’m not down with. A lot of their teachings set my bullcrap alarm off.

[tategarrett]

I think this encapsulates the core of Protestant concerns with Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Almost every other issue can be either resolved or simply set aside in order to have a closer union as different members of Christ's Church, but the existence of infallibly defined dogmas which have little if any evidence for them early on, and which are protected by anathema is a of the utmost concern. Teachings like this put the very salvation of those who discuss them on the line - they're not a matter of whether Christ is spiritually or physically present in the Eucharist or some other issue where the differences ultimately end up in interpretation or expression of a practice.

This nothing less than an irreformable and inflexible dogma being defined, with no Biblical, and even no historical support for centuries after the death of Christ to back it up. And further, it carries with it the pain of anathema which was historically understood to be synonymous with expulsion from the church and damnation. This is very concerning to Protestants who want to live in accordance with the teachings and practices of the early church.

[dannysitumorang]

I think the mystery of Mary's end can be compared to Moses.
Archangel Michael hid Moses' body so the people of Israel will not build a shrine on his bones so they might perform rituals on the shrine to worship Moses. God knew this was the devil's plan.

Imagine if there is a known location of Mary's tomb.
I thank God it remains a mystery.

[jbheavenlyfootman]

Thank you, Dr. Ortlund, for graciously contending for biblical truth. I’m a confessional Lutheran, with a SBC background, and I appreciate your ministry!

[boblob]

Catholics also have the dogma that Mary was a perpetual virgin, even though Matthew 1:25 clearly states that Joseph did indeed have marital relations after Jesus was born.

[brooklynbarber]

The issue with Mary being sinless is that it would defeat the purpose of Jesus conquering sin. The divine nature from the Holy Spirit's overshadowing was sinless, but Mary herself had to be sinful in nature, so that Jesus could take on that nature and conquer it, to be deemed as the perfect sacrifice for our sins.

[Irene]

The crossover I never know could happen!! ✨🙌

[coryscook]

Not now baby, new Gavin Ortlund vid just dropped

[thomasmcgraw]

Mad respect to gavin for being the first protestant to take great care in accurately represent us without demonization. Obviously I disagree for a myriad of reasons and he cant make a Jimmy akins level defense to pick apart in a 13 minute video but I cant exactly hold that against him. All in all, well done

[jvlp]

St. Paul said, "DO NOT GO BEYOND WHAT IS WRITTEN." (1 Corinthians 4:6)... Amen.

[IAmisMaster]

St. John Chrysostom’s Homily 21 on John says Marry sinned at the wedding Canaan and Jesus corrected her.