New Theory of Consciousness Explains Why Zombies Don’t Exist

A collaboration of a neurologist, a computer scientist, and a philosopher has just put forward a new theory of consciousness. It is based on the idea of causal models. The authors claim boldly that their idea solves the hard problem of consciousness and explains why zombies don't exist in nature. Really? I've had a look.

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#science #sciencenews #consciousness

[DataIsBeautifulOfficial]

I'm relieved, but never skipping the double-tap.

[lightsabre]

As a neuroscientist, the claim that ravens don’t have self awareness and therefore are not “conscious” is a bit absurd.

[arctic_haze]

If conscious beings need "the ability to infer casual relations", the authors of the paper have not proved they are conscious

[helnkellrfreshdeaf]

They make a false equivalence between "input data and processing" with "awareness". Without making this false equivalence, input data and processing of internal processes does not equal self awareness.

[johnwollenbecker]

I think about zombies. Therefore they are.

[wl]

"It's like fish need water, humans need coffee, and Elon Musk needs attention; It's just how things work."

[zirize]

I think the zombie referred to in this paper is a philosophical zombie, which is 100% identical in behaviour and thought to a human being, but without consciousness.

[GradiusPilot]

This still doesn’t address the issue of how a thing itself experiences its sensory aspects of consciousness (sights/colours, sounds). If we have no way to explain, measure and compare these, can’t everything be a zombie (including you or me)?

[MrHuman]

I knew from the title this would totally fail to address what the Hard Problem and philosophical zombies really mean, and straight away my guess was confirmed. As usual, they're discussing cognition and information processing, not phenomenal consciousness. They're not telling you why the qualia of redness exists, they're telling you why organisms can detect 650 nm light.

[dirkjenkinz]

Anyone convinced zombies don't exist has never been to Swindon.

[rdyer]

I think most people here have probably heard of the Cordyceps family of fungi, often referred to by the term "Zombie Mushroom". Two questions: 1) Are the healthy insects the fungi infect considered conscious by the standards you're referring to? 2) If so, once the fungus takes over the functions of their body, is the insect still conscious, or is the fungus now conscious, or...??

[LordZero]

It's a very wrong idea. First of all it they just changed the definition of conciousness. Second we can have machines that are not self aware that can react to stimuli and act accordingly.

[AdvantestInc]

This discussion on consciousness being tied to physical bodies raises some interesting questions about AI. If AI ever achieves consciousness, would it require a "body" too?

[phillipjoubert]

* Ophiocordyceps unilateralis inhales slowly *

[TLguitar]

I am only at the start of the video, but I'll repeat the comment I keep making whenever consciousness in AI is discussed:

The binary data used in computer software is completely meaningless in and of itself. It only produces outputs meaningful to us because of how we made the machine code work in conjuction with our specifically curated instruction sets designed into the CPU.

An endless series of practically random two optional voltages doesn't make for a consciousness. We can (or will be able to) make a software that faithfully emulates one, but as far as consciousness being defined as the perception of biological neurons that operate directly on analog signals rather than on digitally ciphered and quantized representations of analog signals, that emulation won't actually be conscious.

[robopoet]

Consciousness creates intelligence. Not the other way around. Awareness is more fundamental than thinking.

[markdowning]

I think Dennett advocated this interventionist hypothesis about 1990, in "Consciousness Explained " and "Towards an Understanding...".
He wrote that any entity which could act on its environment, and monitor the effect of its actions, should be considered conscious.
At the time I found this convincing but depressing, because it seemed to trivialise and demystify my experience of being "me".

[BodieOutdoors]

Zombies walk my street all Day, and night.

[carlbrenninkmeijer]

This is so fundamental, tantalizing innate to us. Thanks for discussing this. The next hard thing is to explain Humor and the bear joke was a first good step in that direction.

[monkerud]

The way its formulated is like the question "why does stuff exist at all" its not that it isn't a mystery or that id doesn't have an answer perhaps, but no material evidence can be brought to bare on the question. Thats it, there cannot be a physicalist solution, there cannot be a panpsychist solution, there cannot be a logical solution, because the simplest criteria to do logic from is the answer. There is nothing you can ever do to answer it, just confuse yourself.