Understanding Orthodox Civilization.

[markm]

Would be interesting if you covered the relatively isolated Orthodox Ethiopian Church, fighting tooth and nail against Islamic expansion as well as European(Italian) Imperialism. They even invaded Yemen at one point to help Byzanitum fight a rogue Jewish kingdom. Their relationship to Ancient civilizations as well as to modern pan Africanist groups such as the Rastas makes it even more unique.

[nobodyofimprotance]

The middle ages, that wonderful time when Italy was thinking about being like ancient Greece and Greece was thinking about being like ancient Italy.

[mrremoveyoureyes]

Just a quick correction: Armenia and Georgia are both Orthodox nations. Georgia is solidly Eastern Orthodox, like the Russians. However, the Armenians are Armenian Apostolic, who are technically a seperate sect of Orthodoxy. However, this is largely because of a theological technicality in the 5th century, and is not really seen as a major issue by the vast majority of Orthodox I know, including myself.

[olbiomoiros]

Why is it that you never include Cyprus in your orthodox maps, but you include it in your Islamic maps? The island was 80% Orthodox before 1974 and still is a majority Orthodox today.

[scottgoodson]

Highly recommend Timothy Ware's "The Orthodox Church" to any interested in Eastern Orthodoxy. Ware is an Englishman who converted to Orthodoxy and has become a Metropolitan (type of bishop). It's very readable for uninitiated Americans, and it gives a lot of this history (and of course some of the theology that undergirds it) in more detail.

[pedrohenriqueassis]

This civilization videos are the best Christmas gift a YouTuber has given out, truly amazing content!

[MorbSquad]

Orthodox Christianity, the Church that can trace it's roots to Christ and His Apostles

[thealphasam]

An interesting fact is that the western Slavs almost became orthodox. In the 9th century a the duke of Moravia invited greek missionaries to stop the growing HRE influence. They actually developed cyrillic, the alphabet that most of the slavic orthodox nations use today. Anyway the duke was eventually overthrown by Svatopluk. This guy was actually pretty competent and expanded Great Moravia and pushed out the german influence. One of the things he did is that he exiled the orthodox archbishop, because he saw him as having too much influence and also an ally of the previous duke(He also exiled all of his scholars). They then moved to neighboring orthodox states in the Balkans and Russia, bringing the alphabet with them. With this, the catholic church returned to Moravia and stayed there. After the death of Svatopluk there was a power struggle between his sons, right in time when the Hungarians arrived and conquered the territory. After that, the Hungarians adopted the dominant religion, so became Catholic. If it weren't for Svatopluk, it is very possible, that we could've seen European civilizations, divided exactly by the lines of the Iron Curtain.

[themutant]

As a member of the Orthodox community I'm happy to see a YouTuber making this type of video. I have always wanted to learn more about the fate and its history.

[cowboybeboop]

As a Bulgarian Orthodox person I`m so happy to finally watch this. I though I would have to wait months to see it. Orthodox civilization is puzzling and complex to understand for us also. I could only imagine what it looks like to a foreigner.

[skeletonkeysproductionskp]

This is so interesting, ever since you showed that you were going to cover this topic I was like: "What new thing am I going to learn here?" Your channel really is an inspiration @Whatifalthist and although my channel is moving away from Alternative History, my videos will never hold a candle to yours! Keep up the excellent work and stay blessed!

[georgios_]

YES oh my god thanks, made my day. Classic Civilization yesterday, Orthodox Civilization today. It's a miracle my Greek mind finds too good to believe

[purelieuvis]

This video was basically "What if Byzantium survived " combined with "What if Soviet Union didnt exist"

[GregMayo]

Man just drew a straight line from Ancient Rome to modern Russia, mind blowing how good this channel is

[SuperAntichicken]

This channel radicalized me. Oh and thanks for cranking out another exceptional series. merry christmas to all who enjoy whatifalthist!

[Remembrance]

Idea: do Native American civilizations before European contact and how they changed in the process. In particular, I’m interested how advanced they really were compared to Europe. It’s hard to get a clear answer today due to biases on both sides.

[Thomas-uq]

A neat summary, and I agree with most of it, but once again there are couple of mistakes, or questionable statements presented as fact. It's frustrating when people confidently say incorrect things about your own part of the world.

1. Georgia is a full member of the communion of Eastern Orthodox Churches, and always has been, doctrinally, politically, etc. Unlike Armenia, which adopted Christianity long before Rome did and possesses entirely it's own traditions and origins.
2. Constantine did *not* make Christianity the 'official religion' of the Roman Empire, he simply ended their persecution and took a personal interest in the religion. But Constantine continued the Imperial cult at Rome, did nothing to act against pagans in the Empire (with the big exception of Jerusalum), and seems to have associated Christianity with his own family-cult of Sol Invictus.
3. Christian sects in the early Byzantine Empire did largely adhere to ethnic lines, but Nestorians were a tiny minority, the main non-Chalcedonian (Melkite) sect was and is Monophysite (Copts & Syriacs). Monophysites were at the doctrinal opposite extreme from Nestorians (Melkites are in the middle), and actually initiated the persecution of Nestorians in the first place. Nestorians were overwhelmingly found east of the Byzantine frontiers, in Persia and Central Asia (they even reached Mongolia and gave them their alphabet).
4. "socialist measures" lol. People who regularly watch your channel know what you're implying (centralised bureaucratisation of the economy) but come on, you *know* how misleading describing one of the most hierachical and unequal economic systems on earth as 'socialism' sounds.
5. No major Slavic merchant class *ever*? I think the Republic of Novogorod would be a pretty exception, certainly Jews and Armenians practically didn't exist in Russia then.
6. Lingual Map. Armenian isn't a Caucasian language, it has no connection to Georgian.
7. Attributing Russia's government style to the Mongols, or discussing the conquest generally, is *hardly* 'very taboo' in Russia, and never has been. Actually there are dozens of old sayings, books, films, and even popular songs in Russia about this, too the point its practically a cliche.
8. Belarus/Ukraine weren't seized by a 'Western Christian' Lithuania, when Lithuania conquered these regions it was still an entirely pagan society. Poland also had nothing to do with these wars at this time, it came to share these East Slavic lands much later, with the union.
9. Most Russian soil is actually fairly poor, the ultra-fertile 'black soil' region is mainly found in Ukraine, Tatarstan and the Caspian-steppe, both regions outside of Muscovite control for much of its history. Actually, America has more prime arable land than any other nation, 99% of which *was never even used before* European colonists arrived.
10. Again with the American jingoism, of course the geography was easy to 'adapt' to when your opponents were hunter-gatherer tribes and you had railroads. Nearly all Russia goes *under -30* (imagine coping with this in pre-industrial times) *every year*. The USSR took the overwhelming brunt of WWII, whilst not a single American civilian in America was ever killed, gee, I wonder why USA won the Cold War.. Ridiculous comparison.
11. Communist map. Comments for missing? Well, Indonesia killed about 500'000 people to squash their socialist movement. Also the PKK in Turkey, avowedly Communist but I guess it's Kurdish separatism in practice. Also the MEK and Republic of Mahabad in Iran. And somehow Mongolia is missing.

[coldplace]

I think you mostly skip the importance of the Bulgarian Empire, and its conversation to orthodox Christianity. They contributed a LOT to the Eastern World and the Slavs migrating in with the invention of the Cyrillic Alphabet, and giving autonomy to the slavs in its empires.

[Jayako]

There's a great example in the orthodox civilisation of merchant elites taking control: The Merchant Republic of Novgorod. It became a massive Center of culture and trade that was projected towards the Baltic Sea.

[fullmtaljacket]

As a catechumen to the Orthodox church, I really appreciate the lengths that you went through to highlight this very misunderstood culture. I might have some slight differences in opinion on one thing or another, but so what...overall a bang up job!