Jordan Peterson challenges Sam Harris on The Enlightenment

Jordan Peterson challenges Sam Harris on The Enlightenment

Sam Harris & Jordan Peterson - Vancouver - 1
Moderated by Bret Weinstein
06/23/2018

This is the first time Sam & Jordan appeared live together on stage. This event took place at the Orpheum Theatre in Vancouver BC Canada on June 23rd 2018 in front of a sold out audience of 3000 people. The event was produced by Pangburn Philosophy.

[jonbainmusicvideos]

The real 'enlightenment' was not 1750. A hundred years earlier Galileo and Newton were inspired by the philosophy of Descartes. The foundation of science was a combination of Christian theology (ethics and spirituality) and ancient Greek math and method for exploring the physical world.

The great con is that the ethic and spirituality gets forgotten as the moral source which must be in place to prevent the power of the physical knowledge from running amok like it did during ww2.

Consciousness and its shadow: pathology; still are only explained by concepts of light and dark. Truth and lie. Neuroses manifests into pathology when the Christian ethic breaks down.

(The crowd just applauds the random jargon.)

[austinm]

Ugh, strawman of the bat from Peterson. The enlightenment isn't a description of an immediate change of human behavior as much as it is a tradition of principles i.e. liberalism and skepticism regarding how to think about the world. Bucking superstition/authoritarianism as a means of behaving is what has primarily contributed to the progress we all take for granted today. This is what Pinker lays out in Enlightenment Now and it's a hell of a read.

[steelcom]

Translation: We better stop here because I can't defend my BS argument.

[er]

well, it depends on the principles ...

[janerkenbrack]

It seems to me that Jordan Peterson comes into these discussions determined to disagree with Sam Harris (or Matt Dillahunty, etc.). And then advertises his lack of knowledge about subjects, and assumes everyone else has less knowledge than he has.

[Will-xfqe]

Obvious strawman and he knows it. It sounds ridiculous.

[steelcom]

I could say that "neurons release brain chemicals, known as neurotransmitters, which generate these electrical signals in neighbouring neurons where they propagate like a wave to thousands of other neurons." Or I could just say "I'm thinking".
Which phrase makes me sound smarter and you'll figure out why Peterson would use the former.

[johncart]

We might have advanced intellectually as a result of the enlightenment. We may have got sharper in our thinking, but our underlying human nature and behavior patterns didn't advance much. It wasn't about dropping these so- called superstition beliefs, but thinking about them more critically. We didn't prove that God doesn't exist in the elightenment. I guess it boils down to interpretation and details taking into consideration.

[steelcom]

I could say "We operate under assumptions" when Peterson prefers to say that "the operation of facts on life have produced a priori implicit interpretative structures that guide our interactions with the facts". Yes, we make assumptions. Peterson wants so desperately for people to think he's a genius.

[hilfsil]

What Jordan says is 70% good stuff and 30% bull shit

[steelcom]

Peterson thinks that threads of knowledge and understanding have to be grounded in some previous principle, which is to a great degree true. But then he assumes that these principles came from some ancient tribe over 2, 000 years ago.
One would think that democracy and freedom would be high on the list, values we hold dear, when there is absolutely no indication that God promotes democracy since he is the Grand Dictator and no indication of freedom since He alone punishes and rewards those He considers deserving.
It's an impossilble idea to support, but that's his schtick.

[biasedlemmings]

Blah, blah, strawman, blah, blah, no BLAH blah, I don't have to unwrap all that, blah, blah, it depends, strawman, time's up, blah, blah, strawman. Me me me me you? No, me me strawman, this is how the archetype goes blah, misogyny, man up dude, blah, strawman fallacy from authority.... me. Blah. Canada apologizes.

[polarbear]

Im no longer believe in jp, hes not listening

[awarenowhere]

Sam Harris is correct and I suspect Jordan Peterson ego is holding on for dear life at prospect that this successful speaker (he thinks Jordan Peterson is) only exist in his mind and isn't based in reality.

[חסד-תי]

I find it humorous how Sam always describes us "modern" folk as so smart and advanced etc. Like those that came before us were so primitive and stupid. I've seen him talk like this over and over and I find it so shallow minded. He is so arrogant to have this mindset.

[Kalaanidhi]

There are two ways of making this argument. If Peterson understands Harris but not vice versa one argument could be made that Peterson is not understandable....other is Harris is too stupid/stubborn. I am of the camp that believes in the latter

[jonbainmusicvideos]

The real 'enlightenment' was not 1750. A hundred years earlier Galileo and Newton were inspired by the philosophy of Descartes. The foundation of science was a combination of Christian theology (ethics and spirituality) and ancient Greek math and method for exploring the physical world.

The great con is that the ethic and spirituality gets forgotten as the moral source which must be in place to prevent the power of the physical knowledge from running amok like it did during ww2.

Consciousness and its shadow: pathology; still are only explained by concepts of light and dark. Truth and lie. Neuroses manifests into pathology when the Christian ethic breaks down.

(The crowd just applauds the random jargon.)