Why F1 Cars Use These Weird Springs

Why do F1 cars have 4 wheels but use 8 springs to control them?

Well, F1 cars produce literal tonnes of downforce, and that enables them to stick in the corners - but it does give the car’s suspension a tough job.

Not only do they need to hold the 798kg of a Formula 1 car - but also the 1-2 TONNES of downforce on top of that. But on top of THAT, the suspension needs to keep the tyres as evenly loaded as possible so the car’s a bit easier to drive.

Rules were simplified in 2022 to outlaw all the fancy tools that F1 teams used to use in the suspension such as remote springs, remote hydraulics and one-way damping - which deserves another video entirely.

These tools were made famous by the ‘collapsing rear wings’ (in case you don’t know what I mean. The rear suspension on some cars last year would collapse mid-way down the straight to save on drag. It was genius) It was allowed in 2021, but is banned now.

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[Kev]

Quote of the year. A tire in the air doesn't typically give a lot of grip.

[joakimeliasson]

I think you've mistaken which part is the stiffer on a dual-rate spring in the graphics. Typically the part with higher pitch, ie. the more loosely coiled part of the spring, is the stiffer part. Therefore the tightly coiled part should compress first.

[NielsHeusinkveld]

1:30 Sorry this is just not true, the amount of roll doesn't affect load transfer. A stock 2CV and one fitted with F1 springs have identical load transfer taking a turn at the same G force. One corners flat and one rolls a lot, but total load transfer is effectively the same.

[Mister_E_or_Mystery]

"Typically...a tire that is in the air, doesn't produce much grip" hahahahah, I love you man!

[mcduvall]

Springs don't require a minimum for to "activate" all springs will compress to some degree regardless of how small of a load is applied. What happens is the soft spring eventually bottoms out and you're left with a stiffer spring.

[NielsHeusinkveld]

If you count these as 8, I would add another 6 to them because each main and third element can also use bump rubbers to control the stiffness and ride height from a certain point in the travel range. Very likely on the 3rd elements, I don't know if they would use them during normal track use on the 4 corner units as well.

[ClaytonMacleod]

That’s not how springs work. You don’t get zero compression in the stiff portion until you get the soft portion binding. And in the case of two separate springs stacked in series you do not get zero compression in the stiff one until the soft one binds. If you have a 100 N/mm spring and a 200 N/mm spring and add a 1000 N load what happens? The 100 N/mm spring compresses by 10 mm AND the 200 N/mm spring compresses by 5 mm, for a total of 15 mm of compression. They are both subjected to the load and they both compress just as much as they would as if they were the only spring there. The 200 N/mm spring would not be sitting there doing nothing until the 100 N/mm spring started binding. That’s impossible. They’re both subjected to the same force. And they both react to the same force. What would actually happen with those two springs is they would be a system equivalent to a 66.67 N/mm spring until the point where the 100 N/mm spring starts binding, at which point it stops behaving like a 66.67 N/mm spring system and starts behaving like a lone 200 N/mm spring. Once the 100 N/mm spring starts binding it can then be treated as a solid piece, or to put it another way, it can then be ignored.

1/total spring behaviour = 1/spring rate A + 1/spring rate B

So, before binding you have two springs in series:

1/total springrate = 1/100 + 1/200

1/total springrate = 0.01 + 0.005

1/0.015

66.67

And once that 100 N/mm portion starts binding you simply remove it from the equation and you’re left with the performance of the 200 N/mm portion. The total system is softer than its two components until the softer of those components ceases to be able to do its job, at which point the total system gets as stiff as the stiffer of the two components, since that’s all that’s left doing the job.

[thebarkingmouse]

Progressive Springs aren't that unusual from what I understand. I used to have Progressive Springs in my front forks on my motorcycle.

[brrosskiee]

Petition for Scott to drive a 2023 fp session

[FairladyS]

That dual rate suspension is going to give varying ride heights so the car would need to be set up so it has grip at all those heights. An explanation of how that is done would have been useful.

[Excludos]

Someone at Driver61 has been watching Kyle Engineers

[cuennicolson]

please talk about those outlawed suspension things

[janitomoto]

1:52 “typically” I wonder when a tire in the air does produce grip. hahaha

[SameerKhan-xngn]

5:25 - Description is incorrect. The bottom section of the spring will be the lower spring rate. You have more material in the same amount of spring height. Essentially you are spreading the deflection over more material. Where the coils get spread out you will have a larger spring rate as each individual coil has to go through more deflection for the overall spring height to change.
Another way engineers tune the springs is by adding material like rubber in between the coils. Allowing the coils to bind earlier in some places vs others. It changes the shape of the k(x) curve by moving the inflection/transition point closer to uncompressed height.

[jamespingel]

"Typically a tire in the air doesn't product much grip" has me wanting to know the one edge case where a tire in the air DOES produce grip.

[peterlang]

We use those on bicycles too. We call them progressive springs because they progressively get stiffer further in the travel. Thanks for the video! I never really understood how they work but I do now thanks to your video

[rtdgreg]

Good and accurate verbal description, but I believe a stress vs strain graph would really help to convey the essence of your message.

[MikkoRantalainen]

For road cars, the spring where the coil has different strength for diffent parts (usually implemented with non-equal rise per turn) is usually called progressive springs in marketing material. It's much better than regular spring but more expensive to manufacture.

[tigertiger]

Springs are a whole industry/ science on their own

[InformatrIIcks]

I thought you were going to talk about heave spring rather than dual rate springs, a bit disappointed on that one :/