“Religion is a great play style” | TierZoo on religion and science

I collabed with TierZoo in 2020 and the results were interesting for us both. TierZoo joins me to talk about religion, science, aliens, free will and more.

Our original collab:

GMS video on the science of why people believe in god:

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Non-sectarian Biblical Studies Courses by Dr. Bart Ehrman (affiliate link):

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Chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:48 How we met / Why collab with an atheist?
10:43 TierZoo gets hate for working with me
14:40 How Drew and Patch have changed their view of religion/atheism
22:52 Can animals commune with the Devs?
24:37 Would aliens have Christianity/religion?
29:03 Why did Patch like my video about trauma motivating religious belief?
38:10 Drew is not a gamer
39:42 Patch’s science background
48:10 Why grad school didn’t work for Patch and Drew
58:00 Patch has questions for atheists
01:12:42 A sneak peak of what’s coming up on TierZoo


This video contains 100% therapeutic grade skepticism.*

*This statement has not been evaluated by the FDA

[amalieselsmark]

"I don't know but I'd love to learn more about it" is such an awesome attitude to have about anything, especially the possibility of religious elephants

[brycengledhill]

I don't fault people for beliefs, I fault organizations for their practices. Drew made that point quite well

[MedlifeCrisis]

Awesome to see you two chat! Two creators I really admire. I had a chuckle at the fact that I also asked Patch’s permission to make a tier list video (about organs!) before I made mine, like this mf is gawddamn emperor of tier lists. ALL HAIL PATCH OF S TIER!

[somersetcace]

I used to be pretty anti-theist as a teenager especially. However, after many years of discussion, debate and plain ole personal experience with theists, I've softened quite a bit on that. I still believe organized religion is more harmful than helpful in most cases, but individual theists or even small fellowships don't bother me. I believe the meaning of life is to give life meaning. If I then mandate how others should go about doing that, I'd be a hypocrite. In the end, so long as you're not victimizing anyone, whatever gets you out of bed is okay by me.

[feedingravens]

TierZoo seems to be a rather "european" christian, one who sees religion as a means for social interaction, a part of the culture, and as a means to shape your OWN thinking, a guide to make you a better person, to give you a gut feeling of hope, a positive attitude - and not as an excuse for judging others, to declare youself as supreme.

Here in Germany a catholic theologian can chat with an asttrophysicist (our "Neil deGrasse Tyson) on TV and freely accept Big Bang and Evolution and that the Bible mainly consists of myths of other cultures - and is NOT excommunicated.

[stanleyhyde]

I would have been happy to listen to you guys chat for hours. You don't often get to hear people have noncombative conversations about religion like this. People with opposite views giving honest answers to hard questions is criminally rare.

[Saezimmerman]

Appreciate the intro conversation about the assumptions that Drew originally made as well as TierZoo remarking that he held back his snarky “toast” comment. The internet can bring people together, but the interactions we have with each other over text/comment (especially early on) don’t have the benefit of reading non-verbal cues. It’s easy to misread each other.

[delongjohnsilver]

The main issue I have with bringing religion to hard times is that it can be exploitative if the belief holder is not careful. It’s in a similar vein to upselling a coffin to a grieving family, or asking someone out when they’re at a low point, and I don’t think that’s something discussed enough in religious community outreach programs from my experience. If it’s not centering the person’s needs first, but instead preaching first, then you’re getting into morally dubious territory.

[buggytheprophet]

I never thought that my first time seeing Tierzoo’s face would be in this channel, but Im not complaining this is amazing!

[emmanuel]

Very nice and wholesome conversation. I honestly prefer these types of exchanges over debates and things of such nature -- of course, debates don't need to be really heated and can be done with a lot of respect and poise, but an amicable conversation that is less structured just seems to put everybody more at ease and to instigate more intellectual honesty by its very format (unless you're dealing with a dishonest person -- those will just take advantage of everything and rules being put in place are the ideal).

[mainecoonmami]

I always have empathy for Christians not only because childhood indoctrination is real and I used to be one, but that human beings find love in different places. If they don’t oppress or vote to oppress other people, I don’t mind. That’s more political than religious.

[ashurean]

I was raised in a particularly religious household, went to this really insulated Baptist church that stoked my father's ego and exacerbated my mother's mental issues, resulting in an incredibly hostile home life for me. I moved away from the church in my early teens because I just never felt any connection, and away from religion entirely when I was 15. I've spent the past almost decade deconverting myself, unlearning problematic ways of thinking and healing from the reflexive fear response that had been drilled into me. During this period of time, I think it would be fair to say I was anti-religion. It's only recently that I've been able to start untangling my thoughts and feelings and have reached the point where I no longer feel the need to define myself in opposition to religion, instead focusing solely on developing in alignment with the things I do care about. While I'm no longer anti-religion, and feel comfortable engaging with religious subjects on an academic level, I would say that I am more focused on contesting the idolatry aspect now. And this reaches beyond organized religion, it's the same kind of thinking that leads people to keep investing in crypto even after they've been scammed repeatedly, or lets them continue supporting a celebrity, billionaire, or politician even when they do something that directly harms them. It's a complicated subject that I only really have the wherewithal to identify and engage with now that I have some distance from being subject to that kind of thought process myself. But what I do know is that I despise how it's viewed as acceptable for these powerful people to encourage this, despite how vulnerable it makes people.

[TrueShepardN]

I am a christian and subscriber of Tier zoo and i love this collab with my favorite skeptic youtuber. Drew you are such a great man and in many ways you are act more like a christian then many christians i have seen. I am 100% behind you in your efforts to fight religious extremism.

[zerog]

This was a fun one! On the subject of being asked "do you believe in free will", I think a good way to get somewhere is to ask the questioner "do you think free will is different than agency and if so how"? That way you can see what specific flavor of "free will" you're really getting at, or is it really just about the ability to make decisions.

[sidcollinsiv]

TierZoo's down to earth understanding of his faith and it's role in the world is perhaps the most effective piece of apologetics I have ever seen.

[jargontrueseer]

I was afraid I'd go into this and not like tierzoo anymore, which was really sad to think about, but after watching it I have a much deeper respect and admiration for both of you. I think you're both trying to do the same thing in being openminded and being polite in communication from two different worlds and it's really amazing to see you both interact. I'm insanely happy to say I'll be watching both of you for the foreseeable future.

[joanfregapane]

I truly enjoyed this conversation. Very civil even friendly talk about lives and beliefs and other real topics. Good collaboration!

[orbracha]

I actually really appreciate the collab you two made because it's how I found both of your channels, and now knowing that TierZoo is himself religious makes me appreciate it that much more

[adNauseam]

I just fell into Tier Zoo’s content so hard - so cool seeing this collab.

[bradydeboer]

Glad to see you post again and hope you're doing better! 😊
It's always refreshing to have a respectful conversation with someone of opposing beliefs (without trying to prove each other wrong)