YA BOOKS AT THEIR WORST

I asked all of you what you thought the worst things were about YA science fiction and YA fantasy, and these are your answers :)

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#yabooks #yafantasy #fantasytropes

[jenniparks]

We need more platonic relationships too X

[Meshuga]

“I don’t want you to be together then, because one of you is so stupid.”

True. Story.

[giuliakenway]

What I've often found (lately in Six of Crows for example) is that the main characters in YA are often said to be around 17 years old but feel at least 21. I know that's not a huge difference in number but when I think about how I thought and acted as a teenager compared to now being in my 20s, I feel like that is a huge difference. And YA characters sometimes just don't feel like genuine teenagers 😅

[molliehaines]

Where are the parents?? Where are the other adults?? It's always the teenagers with no life experience or real knowledge that have to save the world, and these teenagers were usually just introduced to the magic system/other world and are suddenly experts with little to no training.


Also, most books don't have consequences for the mc and when they do, the mc often gets out of them because of plot protection.

[majascha]

I feel like the people who think adult fantasy is too long aren't usually the same people who want more worldbuilding in YA.

Also, for the page count: I feel like a good length is around 450-500 pages. That's usually the length that later entries in YA series tend to have, and long enough to get a satisfying standalone as well. I think that's a perfect balance between "this book has enough time to worldbuild, focus on characters and develop its plot" and "I could still read this on one weekend if I had some other stuff to do as well"!

[ScorpionFlower]

I hadn't notice the "when a ya gets inspiration from a classic we call it a cheap copy, but when a na does it we call it paying homage" thing until you mentioned it and you are so right!

[Katertot]

For "not like other girls": Clary from The Mortal Instruments and Celaena from Throne of Glass are the two that immediately come to mind, but I know there are definitely more out there!

[braam]

I also feel like the new adult genre needs to be more clearly defined because now I'm seeing YA books that seem like the character are just teenagers in age for marketing purposes but it doesn't fit their storylines or the content matter of the book. Like Sarah j maas books have really graphic sex scenes but its targeted at young teens mostly girls. I feel like there needs to be an age range that better fits those of us who are in too old to fully relate to ya and to young to relate to adult. I still read both but it would be nice to have an in between

[tristandukes]

I feel like Mary Sues are more common in YA. I remember reading the Divergent series, and by the last book it felt like it boiled down to Tris making very illogical decisions, people saying "no that's kinda crazy", bad things happening because they disagreed with her decisions, and then Tris is all mad at them and they're like " I am the worse person ever, I should have listened to everything you said blindly oh savior of mankind, can you ever forgive a disgusting wretch like me?". Of course, it's been over 5 years since I read them so it might have just been my teenage angst or something

[Meshuga]

Concerning male protagonists in YA, this is definitely a problem between publishers and the market. A friend of mine was frustrated as a boy, transitioning from Hardy Boy’s mysteries to some insane horror novel about rats gaining sentience and eating people alive. It wasn’t the graphic content that bothered him, it was the dense style and difficult vocabulary that almost put him off reading altogether. Therefore, he made it his mission to write books for boys. He went through several agents and wrote multiple books, and almost got published a few times but the marketing department always shut it down with the same mantra; boys don’t read.

If you want more middle grade and YA books with male protagonists and by male authors, you have to buy and review the ones already on market. Publishing houses worship money, and their demigods are algorithms and spreadsheets. Nothing else will persuade them.

[joecourtney]

Characters are really stupid in YA, lie for no reason and get guilt tripped way too easy. Recently read Truly Devious and it was so refreshing to read a teenage girl who told the truth, and if she had a secret she kept! And told people why but still kept it. Her friends also understood and didn’t get all butt hurt for not being included.

[bonbrindley]

Hate when a couple breaks up because of a misunderstanding or a character doesn't disclose obvious information and it gets out some other way leading to anger and splits!

[spokeforhours]

The "not like other girls" trope used to be very prevalent in the paranormal romance era. On the many books that followed the Twilight formula, the protagonist was often described as smart, introspective, introverted, she was usually very into classic novels, or she'd be a bit of a rebel emo girl, dressing in darker colors, she didn't get kids her own age, but of course, she was still beautiful, just in a more "understated way", which usually made her feel insecure. She was meant to be the direct opposite of the blonde-popular-cheerleader that used to prevail in media. In order to make the protagonist seem better than other girls in the story, authors usually resorted to a lot of girl-hate and shaming of "traditionally girly" traits. The antagonist was shallow and stupid because she dared to enjoy shopping, getting her nails done and wearing high heels. It was ultimately their way of making very insipid main characters likable. She was, (literally described to be) not like other girls, thus special (in spite of no qualities) and deserving of the hero's affection.
Nowadays, largely due to forth wave feminism, we spot these tricks more easily. More than that, readers of YA and romance want to see better-developed heroines that can maintain healthy relationships with other women. There is far less room for all the girl-hate that the "not like other girls" trope evokes, hence, it went downhill since circa 2015. However, it used to be so prevalent and so explicit to the point that even if those who don't call themselves feminists and don't actively seek better female representation, got tired of it. And that's how it became both a meme and something so dreaded that every time someone asks "what's the worst trope?" people will still think of it.

[MarijeOskam]

Honestly the worst part of YA is characters that are said to be around 16 or 17 but they just seem way older to me. In Cruel Prince Jude and Taryn are supposedly only 17, yet Taryn gets married while she is 17 and no one bats an eye. The characters in a lot of YA are made so young so they fit YA better, but in the end they act like they are around 20 or 21. And I feel pretty uncomfortable reading about sex scenes between two 16-year-olds to be honest, idk if that is just me? It seems like authors don’t really understand that there is a big difference between someone who is 16 and in high school and someone who is 21 and in college.

[Dark-wyyb]

In YA books I hate:
– love triangles... Boring and predictable...
– love between two main protagonists ( specialy between chosen one, our famous young male villager that in 1 chapter was no one
and the princess or some similar badass girl )
– Good protagonists. Why always main character is like some kind saint or angel? Most people aren't, even ( or specialy) the best ones. Good realistic person in fantasy based on medieval times should be more medieval. Bloody revenge on antagonist, who killed protagonist parents is much more realistic that forgiveness ( why is almost every protagonist having some kind of stockholm syndrome...) And it doesn't make protagonist bad. Justice is sometimes very brutal. Bitter-sweet ending shouldn't just mean thst good guys win, and one of them died. They should be bitter-sweet themselves. Good guys kill bad guys, not just sing a song about power of love and forgive...
– From zero to hero... It is great when from young noble main character become great king. But most of writers don't know that main hero should be at least lesser noble, not just random peasant. You just can't learn how to fight in few weeks. It takes years. Most of nobles started fight learning when they were 7/8 years old. And they train untill 18/20 yo, when they became real knights. 12 years, not few weeks!

[fares]

The family of the MC being ignored!
This drives me so mad! I get it when the MC has an abusive family but if they aren't I so want to have siblings and parents interactions. I think this goes in tandem with the romance thing everyone mentioned cuz this basically happens when there's too much romance, but I tried googling good family dynamics YA novels and all I found is the opposite, there are some classics but not many if any YA.

[M_aryAnne]

Yes, when there is a romance in YA I feel it becomes the plot and in adult it seems we stay on track with the actual plot. In the books I’ve read in both of those ages.

[BrandonGuimond]

I've tried really hard to read some YA, but almost every time I pick one up, I can barely get through it. The central theme always seems to revolve around teen romance. I'm just passed the point in my life where I enjoy reading about 15-17 year olds having high school "insta-love" crushes. Just doesn't appeal to me. I'd rather read about struggles I can relate to in a complex world, rather than "Johnny loves Suzy but she's dating Benjamin" kind of triangle.

[khaledassaf]

For me, growing up, my problem with YA fiction wasn't necessarily the lack of male protagonists or writers, but more the lack of stories interesting to me, as most books for YA, at the time, seemed to be mostly romance novels, which didn't really interest me back then.

[Ivielynn]

That's one if the reasons why I dont usually read YA. I'm in my 30s and like to read with characters around my age with my age problems lol. I dont usually like to see a 16yr old fight and be badass and better than a grown man that is probably way stronger and has more experience. But when I was in my teens I liked that alot. So really I think things just change when you grow older. I also hate love triangles bc ppl are betraying and hurting eachother and indecisive. Why not just be a loving polyamorous relationship and everyone be together lol. Unless the character is not into that either then idk just no love triangles plz.