Cosmic Skeptic DEBUNKS Cosmic Skeptic! (Morality vs. Free Will)

Alex O'Connor aka @CosmicSkeptic claims that homosexuality is amoral, which means that it has nothing to do with morality. The reason for this is the following: Only actions that are consciously chosen are morally relevant, which doesn't apply to homosexuality, according to Alex. However, in his case for determinism and against free will, Cosmic Skeptic tells us that none of our actions are undergirded by choice. This would mean, however, that morality, as Alex himself defines it, doesn't even exist. And yet, Cosmic Skeptic happily moves on to try and educate us on all sorts of ethical issues. Clearly, there is something fundamentally off with his philosophy.

[DeludedOne]

This is actually a misunderstanding, maybe even a deliberate one. Cosmic Skeptic is talking about desires (although I'm not sure if he's talking about ALL desires or just some desires) in the second segment, that you can't choose to desire something that you don't already have the propensity to desire (in other words, we don't have control over what we desire, but that doesn't necessarily extend to out physical choices and actions based on such desires).

In fact this this actually backs up his first point about how choice determines morality because sexual attraction, like desires, isn't something we have conscious control over, therefore it is neither moral or immoral.

The distinction to be made here is that we can choose whether we want to ACT on our desires or not. For example a man desiring money can choose to rob a bank based on that desire, or he can choose not to do so. But that doesn't change his original desire for money! Regardless of his choice with respect to this desire, it doesn't change the fact that he does desire money (which is usually linked to a desire for survival, but hey, that's going a bit deeper).

Since desires definitely do not encompass the entire scope of all actions or physical choices, then the conclusion of the clip is invalid. The notion that one can't consciously choose not to desire or to desire any one thing, and that one cannot consciously choose one's sexual alignment or preference do not contradict and actually complement one another.

If you think that you CAN choose what you want to desire at any point in time, try desiring food when you're already very full, or not desiring to eat when you're hungry. Not choosing to eat or not eat, but choosing to desire or not desire eating. You can also extend this to sexual alignment. Try being attracted to a woman if you're originally attracted to men, or to a man if you're originally attracted to women. I'm not telling you to act out your attraction, just try to feel attracted to them. Can you do it? Can you switch your sexual alignment anytime you choose?

So if you think there's something fundamentally off in Alex's worldview, that's because you're misinterpreting him, or you've been convinced by someone who's misinterpreted him.

[MrBoston]

*music starts*

Do you want to build a strawman?

[maggiethemagster]

Oh wow, 16 year old Alex’s moral arguments don’t perfectly line up with 20 year old alex’s views…shocker

[chitranshsrivastav]

Spoiler Alert: S T R A W M A N N I N G

[harrypeter]

He said you can't choose what you want not what you do.

[smoothoperator]

"You can do what you will but can't will what you will" - Schopenhaur

This is what Alex also argues. Now make the rest of it

[austinstephens]

Bro strawmanned so hard that his own comment section turned against him

[MadebyJimbob]

Actions are choices, attractions are not actions,

[frtran]

"How many strawmen would you like in the video?"
This guy: "yes"

[dannyboy]

As a gay person I know better then anyone that you can’t decide what your wants are…. I can’t choose to be attracted to women sexually… women just don’t arouse me and there’s nothing I can do about it… I can choose to be intimate with a woman but I can’t choose to want a woman… I’d just be there in bed soft the whole time looking bored 😂😂😂

[paradoxicalenigma]

Way to completely misunderstand what cosmic said entirely.

[zaphyrusm]

CS was entirely coherent here, the possession of desire is not controlled and therefore cannot be within moral judgement. Acting upon desire is not the same thing as possessing desire. In this way, actions willfully taken in the pursuit of un-willfully possessed desires are subject to moral judgement. That judgement could still be moral, immoral, or non-moral. For homosexuality we find Desire = un-willfully possessed = non-moral (Being Homosexual is not a moral topic) and Action = willful = Judgement objectively made against subjectively chosen criteria which could be moral, immoral, or non-moral

[vahramterzikyan]

Strawmaning at its finest. Ever heard of determinism? I bet not

[thesuitablecommand]

Moral evaluations are made on actions, not desires. It is not immoral to desire to, say, hit someone over the head with a baseball bat. However, actually hitting someone over the head with a baseball bat is immoral. In this sense, even if you believe that the act of performing gay sex is immoral, the desire to do so is not. Thus, being homosexual in a void is not immoral. Acting on your homosexuality is where the debate ought to occur.

For the record, I don't think that the act is immoral, either, so long as all participants are consenting and enthusiastic :)

[Nohablaespayon]

I feel like this video has been cut in a way that it misrepresents Alex.

[maksimbolonkin]

If you feel that deflate never addresses the arguments and just fights strawmen then you are right. No blame for him there though, that’s pretty much inherent trait of any apologist.

[AlecSorensen]

I mean, this is an accurate statement of his position. He does in fact believe that nothing is morally relevant, and that moral statements are just emotional reactions to a proposition. To him, there is no such thing as morality beyond an emotional reaction to an action or state of being.

[MrChristerj]

I always wonder if all the examples of homosexuality in nature, like birds, lions, penguins etc. also are in "rebellion against God" or if they just follow the instinct given by God...

[Longtack]

Cosmic Skeptic is correct as he says that morality derives from society - not gawd or religious bigots.

[williamappleford]

my dude, i love your videos and I think you're one of the best Christian YouTubers rn. But Alex has changed his mind on morality quite a lot in the time between the clips you played. he used to think morality didn't exist and was all subjective but since changing his mind on freewill he's also changed his mind in morality.
Although, I do think this is a good criticism of most atheist's morals as I don't agree with a lot of them.