Most Christians Get This Wrong: A Response

Dr. Leighton Flowers walks through portions of this video to demonstrate why Mike Winger is correct in his assessment of Calvinism. JOIN US LIVE!!!

[jayeshipley]

If Calvinism, particularly TULIP, was true, the satan in the book of Job would have no ground, no hope, no chance in getting Job to turn on God. When God said, "Have you considered my servant Job?", the adversary would have pointed out Job was righteous because he had no choice other than to be and do what God decreed/determined. The end, no glory for God, nothing special about Job. No point in the contest.

[janetdavis]

I couldn’t even watch Allen’s video, I got so upset at what he was saying. This system slanders God as far as I’m concerned.

[rhino]

I appreciate you doing this video. Reformedwiki spent 12 minutes out of his 17 minute video mostly agreeing with Alan Parr and then the last 5 disagreeing with Mike and not at all addressing Mike's arguments. He also disabled comments for the video for some reason. I appreciate you and Mike fairly representing the Calvinist argument and then refuting it rather than a strawman. That is what won me over out of Calvinism and that is how we should always engage debates.

[womanatthewell]

Calvinism theology honestly makes me very dizzy…. Who is the author of confusion 👹👿 add to that they have such a low view of lost people that Jesus came and died for! They misinterpret and twist Gods love. Superiority doesn’t belong in Gods kingdom!

[adriannelea]

Reformed Wiki referred to Mike Winger as an Arminian at the end of his video 🤦🏻‍♀️ As if Calvinism & Arminianism are the only two options….

[eileenalexander]

SO grateful for you, Dr. Flowers and Mike Winger.

[brandone.]

I listen to this channel often, but your “pie” illustration is great and what I needed.

[fg]

Great video. I love the way the information is presented. I used to be Calvinist but have absolutely abandoned it. I actually have so much more hope for people than I used to. Thank you so much and I pray you continue putting out great content.

[brucegolston]

Reformed wiki intentionally defines points in tulip in ways that would be palatable to regular Christians to make it easier to trap them into calvinism. It's not an accident.

[rlee]

I love how calvinists always set up the narrative to sound like we don't believe predestination.

No. We believe, we just disagree with the calvinist interpretation of predestination.

[jesuscross]

In minute 35:36 you mentioned a very important point that I have said for a long time. I have been compelled to street preach for 32 years now. In that time I have met literally hundreds of other street preachers. The funny thing I have noticed is that in 32 years, not once have I met a single Calvinist street preacher. Not once. Also I have inadvertently attended two different churches that I learned later, after attending for several years, that they were Calvinists. In both churches I have invited several members many times to go street preaching with me, and not once could I get a single person to go. Compare that with the non calvinist church I attended who actually had a street ministry team appointed. What I'm saying is as a general rule, I have found that Calvinists have no motivation to go reach the lost for Christ. This is the most deadly thing about this false teaching. It completely stifles the work of God.

[mosart]

Yes! Your Prodigal Son breakdown is so brilliantly illustrative, easy to grasp and retell! To carry it further, The Father didn't send a telegram, or seem to influence the son in any way, EXCEPT for the son's knowledge of the Father's character, "I would at least have food and a place to sleep"... the son was counting on the Father's kindness, not on his (the son's) deservedness. Therefore, we need to show the Father's character to people, "How will they know unless they are told?"

[awesomefacepalm]

Hyper Calvinism is just consistent Calvinism. And a Consistent Calvinist is a panentheist

[BirdseyeVu]

“…doomed from the womb…” 🤦‍♂️ Good thing Twitter didn’t exist in Calvin’s era.

[somethinggood]

Thank you for defending Mike winger, a faithful brother in Christ.

[NowTheEndBeginsMinistries]

Aggravates me when Calvinists like Alan say that "God can do anything He wants to do" because that is not true. God has obligated Himself within His word, and must perform that which He has promised, which of course He will.

[garythomas]

Enjoyed this. I come from a Wesleyan tradition, and my father introduced me to the works of Robert Shank many years ago. I have always been grateful for that. Looking forward to your books as well.

[josephbrandenburg]

I find it weirdly inconsistent that hardcore-Calvinist types, especially the channel you are responding to, emphasize the need for repentance almost to the point of making salvation works-based, but they hold the "most monergistic" doctrine.
I don't get it. It seems that if you believe in unconditional election and irresistible grace, you wouldn't be intimidated by "easy-believism". Sometimes I get the feeling these people just want to be a stumbling block. It's elitism. Make the gospel more and more exclusive, then you can feel more and more special (and prideful).
And that's another thing that makes my head spin. If Calvinism is, indeed, the great "Pride-killer", why are so many of them palpably arrogant? It certainly isn't exclusive of them. But it's a stereotype with a grain of truth.

[thomasjohns]

I had never heard of Calvinism until a few years ago. I actually came out of over 30 years of believing the word of faith/prosperity gospel. I got out by learning how to study my Bible inductively and objectively. (Thank you Kay Arthur and Precept Ministries) I learned the truth and I am so thankful that God has shown me His truth. I now go to a church that holds to Calvinism. I started leaning that way until I realized that my inductive and objective Bible study showed me otherwise. For instance, I am currently studying 1st Thessalonians. In Chapter 1 verses 4-5, it says "knowing, brothers and sisters, beloved by God, His choice of you; for our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction; just as you know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sakes." The word choice is ἐκλογή (eklogē), ῆς (ēs), ἡ (hē): meaning a choice, selection, election. So a Calvinist would say that the Thessalonians were elected and are preserved. They were created to be saved... But, in chapter 3, verse 5 it says "For this reason, when I could no longer endure it, I also sent to find out about your faith, for fear that the tempter might have tempted you, and our labor would be for nothing." Hmm, so if Paul believed that the Thessalonians were elected, why was he worried that they would be tempted and his labor would be in vain?
Then, in verses 9-10 it says "For what thanks can we give to God for you in return for all the joy with which we rejoice because of you before our God, as we keep praying most earnestly night and day that we may see your faces, and may complete what is lacking in your faith?" Incomplete faith? Isn't faith a gift? Is there assembly required? Is it partial faith?
I hope to convince my Calvinistic brothers that they need to let God's Word say what it means and not read it subjectively. Take off the Calvinistic lenses. Thanks for hearing me out.

[stove]

Predestination refers to the SYSTEM(S) God has predestined to be the system that those who believe will be integrated into.

Eg if I believe, then I KNOW that I WILL definitely be conformed to the image of His Son. This is because He predestined that system to be in place. It has nothing to do with “predestined to believe” like the Calvinists vigorously purport that you find nowhere in the text.