Are Scandinavian Countries Socialist?

Are socialists “liars?” Depends on your definition — and whether they truly believe what they say. But this much is for sure: they tell and/or believe in lies.

Those lies, though, are persuasive to a lot of people. Once upon a time, they were even persuasive to our Story Editor, who in this video comes clean as a former Bernie Bro who believed in his politics and in democratic socialism.

Along with Juan Carlos Hidalgo, President of the Social Christian Unity Party in Costa Rica and CATO’s former policy analyst for Latin America, he takes us through 8 of the lies of socialism that he once found compelling.

Together, they put forth a combination of real-world data, logic, and imagery that addresses those 8 lies and explains why they’re so wrong … and so dangerous.

#BernieSanders #socialism #Scandinavia #Cuba

LEARN LIBERTY:

[gustav]

As a Danish person: Denmark is not socialist in European standards, but in American standards it is. Problem solved.

[alexostgaard]

Great, then let's adopt their very non-socialist welfare policies i.e. universal healthcare!

[vadlasletta]

Sanders is talking about Finland, It is NOT a part of Scandinavia. It is a Nordic country. However finland and the scandinavian countries all use the nordic model, so I am willing to forgive that.

Sanders said: They have a very democratic society with strong socialist democratic principles.

And he is not wrong. The Nordic model is not socialism, but a free market economy where Sanders’ socialist democratic principles are: health care, education, a progressive tax system, maternity/paternity leave the welfare state.

So: Both clips are true.

See wikipedia’s articles about
Social democracy and social market economy, focus on the misconceptions mentioned under social market economy.

[Samiod]

Blatant misinformation. Social-Democracy is liberal economy with government regulations to protect the working class. It is not simply socialism. By that definition, scandinavian countries ARE social democracies.

[Tiogar]

Well, im danish, and that guy was a right-wing dude who very much wanted to make denmark more capitalist.
25% of denmark votes for socialist parties, around 50% for centrist parties and 25% for market parties. So it's quite balanced.

[dennistesolat]

Has Bernie ever said that he was against a market economy? I'm sorry bud but you're way too simple

[ProletariatSympathiser]

Right, allow me to break down the misconception here. So Mr. Sanders knows, and we all know that these Nordic countries are indeed not socialist. He said they have strong democratic socialist principles which is correct. These democratic socialist principles in which he’s referring to are quite well abided by in the Nordic countries. It’s the belief that social and economic decisions should be made by those whom they most affect. Economically it would be the workers in their companies. This is why they form trade unions to democratically decide each others wages and how the business is ran. and socially it’s everyone. Which is why they have such good healthcare and education systems. Combining democratic, and socialist principles. “Democratic Socialism.”

[PizzaChess]

Stalin is the kid that gets bullied at school and then gets punished by the teacher for fighting back.

[Pacdad]

The right: social democracies aren’t socialist

The left: let’s make America a social democracy

The right: “ThAt’S sOcIaLiSm!”

[rolandjohansson]

Americans will always believe what they desire to believe.

[alessiosandro]

What europeans think americans mean: socialism
What americans mean in reality: social democracy

[kieronbadenhorst]

The 8 key Characteristics of the Nordic model:
1. Regulated working life
2. Active labour Market policies
3. Achieve high levels of employment
4. A strong public sector
5. Tax-finances universal welfare benefits.
6. Free education and Healthcare
7. Equality between genders
8. Small open economies.

So maybe not a duck but something similar to a duck.

[JIrish]

Thats fine but its not a full corporatist state either.

The country still maintains democratic elections, a market-driven economy, and competitive private enterprises. Therefore, while there are corporatist-like features in the structure of Norwegian governance, it is still best understood as a social democracy, with strong market mechanisms alongside social welfare programs.

[Awww]

For those of you progressives wondering why the United States cannot and should not adopt nordic politics and economics...

The Nordic social democracies are as successful as they are because they can be. Their combined land area (the five sovereign states, not including Greenland or the Faroe Islands) is 509, 526 square miles, with Sweden being the largest (173, 860 sq mi). However, the United States' total area is 3, 796, 742 square miles. In other words, the United States' area is more than seven times larger than all of the Nordic countries put together. None of them are bigger than Texas (total area: 268, 596.46 sq mi). If the entire United States were the size of an average Nordic country, it could also be a compact unitary state with one central governing body instead of a vast federal state where powers and responsibilities need to be shared between the national and local governments.

Additionally, their combined population is, according to recent estimates, 27, 608, 486 with Sweden being the most populated (10, 402, 070, according to 2020 estimates). The United Sates' population is approximately 331, 893, 745, which is more than twelve times larger than the Nordic countries' combined population. None of them have more people than Ohio (approx. 11, 799, 448 people). This is due in large part to the colder climate of Northern Europe which causes the Nordic countries to have some of the lowest population densities in the world. Large portions of their populations live close to their capital cities. Their social securities nets can provide for the needs of their citizens because five or ten million people is a more reasonable burden than over 300 million, which is insurmountable.

The demographics of people who live in the Nordic countries are also important. Although each of them have seen increases of immigration in recent years, they are very culturally, linguistically and ethnically homogeneous compared to the United States and a large amount of the immigration they experience occurs among themselves. Such homogeneity enables the Nordic societies to enjoy much greater cohesion and cooperation between classes and politicians than the United States. Their national legislatures are unicameral (meaning only one chamber) because their law-makers don't need as many checks and balances, since all of their consituents have more shared consensus. The United States Congress by contrast, is a bicameral legislature with two chambers (the House of Representatives and the Senate) which slowly pass legislation but fairly represent the highly diverse segments of American society.

In conclusion: The Nordic countries are doing so well because their Nordic Model is a variety of Social Democracy which was specifically tailored for them but it's not a one-size-fits-all system. Social democracy works best when it is implemented in smaller, less populated and less diverse societies such as the Nordic countries. If the United States were to adopt Social Democracy, as implemented in the Nordic Model, it would inevitably collapse because of the sheer size, the highly diverse nature of American society and the peculiar needs of all Americans. Not all nations are built the same and it's not fair to look at the United States through the lens of a Nordic social democracy. The United States is far from perfect but that doesn't mean the policies of Nordic countries would be perfect for Americans either.

[meody]

it has implemented socialistic principles, which makes it communist/marxist (meaning leaning towards the direction of socialism, both in a negative and positive way). but neither does Bernie, or Scandinavian countries or any reasonable socialists call Scandinavian countries socialist.

[deanhunter]

How many mansions does Berni own again ?

[momu]

Did he just call Bernie Sanders and Pol Pot socialists?

[permadsen]

Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot was not socialist.

[swedishancap]

The principle of "from each according to ability, to each according to need" was invented by Karl Marx. This is effectively what the "Nordic model" accomplishes, but with a market. People call it a market so that they can dismiss any accussation that problems with the system are due to central planning. They introduce private companies into providing services for tax money which distorts prices and the supply and demand curve. The fact that people like you are making the argument, that "the nordic countries are not socialist and therefore socialism still doesn't work" just makes the problem worse, as it makes it possible for technocrats to say "Look, people from your Neo-liberal team think that the nordic model is fine". Maybe it isn't socialist, but that doesn't mean that it's good. The medias view of these countries are wrong and many of the problems that we have stem from the structurally instituted political economic planning.

Please stop using this argument. Bernie does not know what he is talking about, he is not a democratic socialist, he is a social democrat and that is almost as bad.

[HysjMysj]

Norwegian here, we're socialists more thsn capitalists. But not according to the American standard, where North Korea is socialists