Is God Perfect? | Episode 707 | Closer To Truth

What does it mean for God to be "perfect"? Perfectly knowledgeable? Perfectly powerful? Perfectly good? Did God create the "perfect world"? That'd be hard to believe. Featuring interviews with Brian Leftow, Richard Swinburne, J.P. Moreland, Walter Sinnott-Armstrong, Keith Ward, and Philip Clayton.

Season 7, Episode 7 - #CloserToTruth

Closer To Truth host Robert Lawrence Kuhn takes viewers on an intriguing global journey into cutting-edge labs, magnificent libraries, hidden gardens, and revered sanctuaries in order to discover state-of-the-art ideas and make them real and relevant.

Closer to Truth presents the world’s greatest thinkers exploring humanity’s deepest questions. Discover fundamental issues of existence. Engage new and diverse ways of thinking. Appreciate intense debates. Share your own opinions. Seek your own answers.

#Theology #Religion

[startupschannel]

This is VERY best podcast show that I have ever discovered. NOT this particular episode, but the show in whole. For me it is life changing. It is NOT a religious AMAZING!!!

[mickeybrumfield]

It seems to be difficult for humans to talk about the perfection of God without an occasional smile on their face.

[matriputra]

Any attempt to understand God as a being separate from ourself will lead you only to silliness...

[tyamada]

A segment from 'Saved by the Light of the Buddha Within'...
My new understandings of what many call 'God -The Holy Spirit' - resulting from some of the extraordinary ongoing after-effects relating to my NDE...

Myoho-Renge-Kyo represents the identity of what some scientists are now referring to as the unified field of consciousnesses. In other words, it’s the essence of all existence and non-existence – the ultimate creative force behind planets, stars, nebulae, people, animals, trees, fish, birds, and all phenomena, manifest or latent. All matter and intelligence are simply waves or ripples manifesting to and from this core source. Consciousness (enlightenment) is itself the actual creator of everything that exists now, ever existed in the past, or will exist in the future – right down to the minutest particles of dust – each being an individual ripple or wave.
The big difference between chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and most other conventional prayers is that instead of depending on a ‘middleman’ to connect us to our state of inner enlightenment, we’re able to do it ourselves. That’s because chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo allows us to tap directly into our enlightened state by way of this self-produced sound vibration. ‘Who or What Is God?’ If we compare the concept of God being a separate entity that is forever watching down on us, to the teachings of Nichiren, it makes more sense to me that the true omnipotence, omniscience and omnipresence of what most people perceive to be God, is the fantastic state of enlightenment that exists within each of us. Some say that God is an entity that’s beyond physical matter – I think that the vast amount of information continuously being conveyed via electromagnetic waves in today’s world gives us proof of how an invisible state of God could indeed exist.
For example, it’s now widely known that specific data relayed by way of electromagnetic waves has the potential to help bring about extraordinary and powerful effects – including an instant global awareness of something or a mass emotional reaction. It’s also common knowledge that these invisible waves can easily be used to detonate a bomb or to enable NASA to control the movements of a robot as far away as the Moon or Mars – none of which is possible without a receiver to decode the information that’s being transmitted. Without the receiver, the data would remain impotent. In a very similar way, we need to have our own ‘receiver’ switched on so that we can activate a clear and precise understanding of our own life, all other life and what everything else in existence is.
Chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo each day helps us to achieve this because it allows us to reach the core of our enlightenment and keep it switched on. That’s because Myoho-Renge-Kyo represents the identity of what scientists now refer to as the unified field of consciousnesses. To break it down – Myoho represents the Law of manifestation and latency (Nature) and consists of two alternating states. For example, the state of Myo is where everything in life that’s not obvious to us exists – including our stored memories when we’re not thinking about them – our hidden potential and inner emotions whenever they’re dormant – our desires, our fears, our wisdom, happiness, karma – and more importantly, our enlightenment.
The other state, ho, is where everything in Life exists whenever it becomes evident to us, such as when a thought pops up from within our memory – whenever we experience or express our emotions – or whenever a good or bad cause manifests as an effect from our karma. When anything becomes apparent, it merely means that it’s come out of the state of Myo (dormancy/latency) and into a state of ho (manifestation). It’s the difference between consciousness and unconsciousness, being awake or asleep, or knowing and not knowing.
The second law – Renge – Ren meaning cause and ge meaning effect, governs and controls the functions of Myoho – these two laws of Myoho and Renge, not only function together simultaneously but also underlies all spiritual and physical existence.
The final and third part of the tri-combination – Kyo, is the Law that allows Myoho to integrate with Renge – or vice versa. It’s the great, invisible thread of energy that fuses and connects all Life and matter – as well as the past, present and future. It’s also sometimes termed the Universal Law of Communication – perhaps it could even be compared with the string theory that many scientists now suspect exists.
Just as the cells in our body, our thoughts, feelings and everything else is continually fluctuating within us – all that exists in the world around us and beyond is also in a constant state of flux – constantly controlled by these three fundamental laws. In fact, more things are going back and forth between the two states of Myo and ho in a single moment than it would ever be possible to calculate or describe. And it doesn’t matter how big or small, famous or trivial anything or anyone may appear to be, everything that’s ever existed in the past, exists now or will exist in the future, exists only because of the workings of the Laws ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’ – the basis of the four fundamental forces, and if they didn’t function, neither we nor anything else could go on existing. That’s because all forms of existence, including the seasons, day, night, birth, death and so on, are moving forward in an ongoing flow of continuation – rhythmically reverting back and forth between the two fundamental states of Myo and ho in absolute accordance with Renge – and by way of Kyo. Even stars are dying and being reborn under the workings of what the combination ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’ represents. Nam, or Namu – which mean the same thing, are vibrational passwords or keys that allow us to reach deep into our life and fuse with or become one with ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’.
On a more personal level, nothing ever happens by chance or coincidence, it’s the causes that we’ve made in our past, or are presently making, that determine how these laws function uniquely in each of our lives – as well as the environment from moment to moment. By facing east, in harmony with the direction that the Earth is spinning, and chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo for a minimum of, let’s say, ten minutes daily to start with, any of us can experience actual proof of its positive effects in our lives – even if it only makes us feel good on the inside, there will be a definite positive effect. That’s because we’re able to pierce through the thickest layers of our karma and activate our inherent Buddha Nature (our enlightened state). By so doing, we’re then able to bring forth the wisdom and good fortune that we need to challenge, overcome and change our adverse circumstances – turn them into positive ones – or manifest and gain even greater fulfilment in our daily lives from our accumulated good karma. This also allows us to bring forth the wisdom that can free us from the ignorance and stupidity that’s preventing us from accepting and being proud of the person that we indeed are – regardless of our race, colour, gender or sexuality. We’re also able to see and understand our circumstances and the environment far more clearly, as well as attract and connect with any needed external beneficial forces and situations. As I’ve already mentioned, everything is subject to the law of Cause and Effect – the ‘actual-proof-strength’ resulting from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo always depends on our determination, sincerity and dedication.
For example, the levels of difference could be compared to making a sound on a piano, creating a melody, producing a great song, and so on. Something else that’s very important to always respect and acknowledge is that the Law (or if you prefer God) is in everyone and everything.

NB: There are frightening and disturbing sounds, and there are tranquil and relaxing sounds. It’s the emotional result of any noise or sound that can trigger off a mood or even instantly change one. When chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo each day, we are producing a sound vibration that’s the password to our true inner-self – this soon becomes apparent when you start reassessing your views on various things – such as your fears and desires etc. The best way to get the desired result when chanting is not to view things conventionally – rather than reaching out to an external source, we need to reach into our own lives and bring our needs and desires to fruition from within – including the good fortune and strength to achieve any help that we may need. Chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo also reaches out externally and draws us towards, or draws towards us, what we need to make us happy from our environment. For example, it helps us to be in the right place at the right time – to make better choices and decisions and so forth. We need to think of it as a seed within us that we’re watering and bringing sunshine to for it to grow, blossom and bring forth fruit or flowers. It’s also important to understand that everything we need in life, including the answer to every question and the potential to achieve every dream, already exists within us.

[l.siqueira]

Wow! Hearing Philip Clayton's words I've remembered of Philippians 2, 7. That's beautiful!

[mauriciogranados]

A Universe is a faithful reflection of its Creator.

[LegionarioCruel]

I never participate in a discussion about god without starting by defining the specific concept of "god" that is in question.

[Simon.the.Likeable]

Closer to Truth consistently shows God to be perfect, perfectly defined into being through semantic word games.

[bretnetherton]

Awareness is known by awareness alone.

[frankwhelan]

Why would a perfect being need praise ?

[MeTaLISaWeSoMe]

I don't think God is perfect. He is wrathful, envious, unforgiving in many instances, and incredibly manipulative. He lies often, as he did in the Garden with Adam and Eve when he told them that the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil would kill them.

Yet that's the point. God is a parent, one wanting nothing but his children to better themselves. He has never given up on us, no matter how many times we have failed in his eyes. He's always forgiven us or given us the ability to forgive ourselves. He has always wanted to see us do better.

In fact he does nothing but tell us to be the opposite of himself. He is wrathful, but he tells us to not be. He is envious, yet he tells us not to covet. He is unforgiving, yet asks us to forgive those who tresspas against us.

God is not perfect, but he wants us to be. As all parents he wants us to not imitate him but be better. He wants us to be beings of purity.

That's my view anyway.

[ApPersonaNonGrata]

Any hypothetical Super-Being who created what some call "evil", or who designed a universe to perpetuate or accommodate extreme suffering ... would be a sociopath (at best).
Morally speaking, it would be no different than he himself doing all the evils that people do.

"With great power comes great responsibility".

A being who CAN limit the degree of suffering experienced by others, to ensure none suffer super-horrifically, ... is a being who is automatically ethically bound to do exactly that.

Sentient beings do not need extreme injustice or extreme suffering in order to roughly maximize their appreciation for justice, health, beauty, relationships, comforts, etc.. For that, we only need a carefully limited degree of diversity; which is what should have been installed "by design" (as a hard limit) into the parameters of human's (and other animal's) experiences.

In fact, the gross excess of suffering that exists for countless people ... actually takes dramatically away from their access to the finer experiences.

Now, a religious person might argue "so what?"; either because they themselves lack compassion
or because their compassion is ample BUT held back behind an unfortunate damn, because of their religious narrative. So then they might say "this is nothing, compared to an eternity of bliss that awaits us". But that's actually horrendously problematic thinking, on many levels. If anyone asks me to elaborate on what I'd say that's so problematic, I'd be happy to walk them through it.

[eddenz]

What if god exists but he’s not perfect ?
What necessitates his perfection anyway?
What if god has an evil side ? This would explain a lot. Or a sense of humor? Or does things simply for his entertainment? Or break the boredom of eternal existence?

[martinphipps]

Hard to say. First he would need to actually exist.

[rickybruce]

Really enjoying your explorations of these varied topics. On this one, it is interesting to see the mental gymnastics people go through to ensure their preiexisting belief is not challenged.

[mockupguy]

No. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. There is no one strict definition of perfect. It is an opinion. So god might be perfect in some opinions but not in others.

As a matter of fact, this leads us to a reverse ontological argument.
The most perfect is the one without any flaws. All know things have flaws. The only thing without flaws is the thing that does not exist.

[RolandHuettmann]

By definition, God could not be described with any attribute. God is neither perfect, nor imperfect, neither bad nor good. God is beyond the relativity, not even can be a "maximum" since a maximum is relative. As an analogy, moving objects need a force outside of themselves to move, for example they are driven by a motor. What created the relative world would be outside of whatever describes the relative world to make the world come about. I sense that the deeper meaning to not create an image of God is that God is beyond any image. Logic could never explain God for that reason. Possibly, achieving pure consciousness could allow us to go beyond the relative, leaving all attributes behind and become one with that formless state. Belief or Non-Belief do not make a difference here.

[neffetSnnamremmiZ]

Perfection is the goal..means "gods arrival"..

[alevan]

Nothing is ever perfect, it can always be better...you can't measure

[hazardousmaterials]

This video is very timely for me. As a pantheist, I’ve been wondering this question for a while, and I’ve decided: No, God isn’t perfect. God fails. As understood in pantheism, God is the Universe itself, thus God-as-Universe struggles, tries, improves, gets things wrong, enters conflict and contradictions with other parts of God’s being, learns, dusts off and tries again. This is how God-as-Universe is magnified and glorified - by the ever increasing goodness of Creation.