Walter Sinnott-Armstrong - Is God Perfect?

What does it mean for God to be perfect? Perfectly knowledgeable? Perfectly powerful? Perfectly good? Perfectly free? Did God create the 'perfect world'? That'd be hard to believe. Must God, in order to be God, be the greatest conceivable Being? Is there a difference between what is conceivable and what is possible, especially for God?



Walter Sinnott-Armstrong is an American philosopher. He specializes in ethics, moral psychology, neuro-ethics, the philosophy of law, epistemology, the philosophy of religion, and informal logic.


Closer to Truth, hosted by Robert Lawrence Kuhn and directed by Peter Getzels, presents the world’s greatest thinkers exploring humanity’s deepest questions. Discover fundamental issues of existence. Engage new and diverse ways of thinking. Appreciate intense debates. Share your own opinions. Seek your own answers.

[paulyaron]

I am confident that that our understanding of perfection is as imperfect as our understanding of God.

[jessicarose]

The Bible does indeed state that God is perfect in Matthew 5:48, “Be perfect, therefore, as your Heavenly Father is perfect.” In context, this passage would imply part of that perfection we strive to be in God’s image is loving our enemies.

What else qualifies as perfection is beyond me, but it’s not just the theologians claiming God’s perfection. The Bible does say He is, so it’s not a concept we have just pulled out of thin air over time.

[credterfe]

How can we comment on whether God is perfect unless we already know Him, know his deeda and know how he responds to certain situations. Even then we have to rely on our own standards of perfectness for judgment .

[kizo]

Your concept of God start from an assumption as all do. you started from a underlying idea that perfection is the act of being good without anything causing you to change from being good. people who believe in god start from the assumption that being perfect is being good and fair to both parts. even if it means being bad relatively from others point of view. if we see their believe in the devil they say that God gave him the opportunity to change but after a certain time he will take action so that he is also fair for the other side of the coin .

[B.S...]

If god is good what is the purpose of psychosis? How is god served by those who have lost contact with reality, other than posting comments on YT? Gratuitous suffering contradicts the existence of a perfectly moral supreme being and there is no way around it.

[thomashartl]

God is the sum of the desires for perfection that believers project into an abstract being. That is why there are so many different gods, because every culture and every epoch produces different views of perfection.

[catherinemoore]

I don't know about God but my ex felt perfect. I had to divorce him because of it.

[Self-Duality]

God self-generates. Perfection is the most primitive operation: self-generation.

[AtheistCook]

its so refreshing to hear a rational argument about the so called perfection of god, without the fear that religions and pastors had put on us about questioning the power of god, i remember hearing that "doubt was inplanted by the devil", or " do not question the infinite power of the lord" all to keep me controlled by religion, i am glad i left and i am much happier now. Yes, We Atheist can be happy and productive members of society unlike what i was fed by the church as a child, we create our own purpose.

[CBWMSJR]

Don't know where some of y'all went to Sunday school. If God is creator he is also the definer. Comprehension of God is like comprehension of the 12th dimension. My thoughts are above your thoughts my ways are above your ways. If you going to postulate about God let God be God without restraints or the only restraints would be self restraints in the interests of creativity.

[J]

The omni's should never have been included in any bible. It reveals the concept (God) as a logical contradiction.

[longcastle]

One of the most intelligent guest so far on the question of God.... Obviously if God does exist we haven't come close as a species to describing or understanding him. And really have done more harm than good to ourselves with our experiments with God and Religion. Really too bad we don't have what it takes as a species to say, let's try it without God for awhile and see how it goes... At least not God in any organized and/or especially any political sense.

[Robinson]

Robert Lawrence on fire here, sharp as a knack and totally on point, such a great question, what does 'perfect' even mean, and why? Why does perfection even need to be good? Or is good that which is perfect? So much confusion!

[amincano]

Why he is not speaking the holy book of Islam Quran instead of the bible when he is saying there is more foults in bible this man Need Education

[abelincoln]

Why are you asking an Atheist about the perfection of God?

This is complete nonsense.

We know for a fact ... that Mankind is not perfect. We have free will, to think, believe & do what we want ... and ...to do good or evil ... and make mistakes or bad choices.

Again. Why you seeking an answer to a question about the nature of God ... from imperfect Atheists who does not believe in God, & has his own beliefs about what "perfection" is, the religions & follows of God?

What ever your "opinion" about the Bible(Torah) ... it clearly states that God made Man in his image & would live forever reigning over the Universe. But God made one simple rule .... that Man must not eat from the Tree of Knowledge.

Adam & Eve were created perfect ... with free will ... and the ability to create other human beings with souls & freewill. God gave them all of the Universe ... to be "creators." But do not eat from the tree of knowledge.

And what did Adam & Even do? They disobeyed God ( sinned) and ate from the forbidden tree ... and from that point on, they created evil(sin), became IMPERFECT, began to decay & die, and passed on their IMPERFECTION ( evil ) to their descendants.

Again. We know for a fact ... that we are all IMPERFECT ... and have free will ... to do good or evil, and think, belief & do as we wish.

We create evil when we think & do evil. Stop blaming God for what we chose to think & do.

God created Man is his image .... to dwell with them .... forever. Man was perfect like God, has free will like God, can create things like God. It is not God's fault that you use your free will for sin.

Sin is simply ... not doing God's will. Adam & Eve did not do God's will, ate the forbidden fruit, ... and created evil. God is perfect & all good. It is impossible for God .... to sin ... or not do God's will.

[michaeljacobs]

There is no greater miracle than the gift of life that we must not forget that man emerged from being close to the animal world in the process of evolution we shed our tails, evil is with man not with our Creator. In view of the interactive process of evolution together with freewill the original concept/purpose is towards perfection, as the chasm between the mind concept and the material world comes Closer to Truth of realization, as the dream landscape merges ever closer to the edges of the dream.

[scooby]

The title threw me off. I was expecting a hardcore apologist and was ready for all of the eye rolling.

[jackarmstrong]

I can't imagine anything more sick than some creature that wants me to worship it and will harm me greatly if I don't. That is evil.

Perfection does not need nor desire worship.

[leonoradompor]

Do not blame God for evil things and sufferings, it is the people who choose to do evil, the evil things has bad consequences****

[FLMHPP]

But the question... did God really write the Bible... as you described full of imperfections? Or was it corrupted by those who followed? Was it really the word of God..or the word of Mark, Mathew, John..etc? How about studying the Quran ... and see if you can find similar contradictions?