Do Not Buy an Island Packet - CHAINPLATES! - Episode 224 - Lady K Sailing

This week we talk about Island Packet Sailboats and buying a sailboat. What to look for in a sailboat and what to avoid including the Island Packet Chainplate issues as well as replacing sailboat chainplates and inspecting chainplates. We talk about the price of used sailboats and comparisons from different sail boats.

[gnsmk]

Very Well Done. Not only is this good insight into buying smart, you could save a life with this information. Great Video.

[speakeasyusa]

Hope everyone watches the whole video for its great info! Any IP before the year 2000ish should get new chainplates AND new water and holding tanks. Many have already had these fixes/updates/upgrades done and the listing usually says so. We chose not to deal with that at all, because we could do so budget-wise. For a lower-budget option, and older IP is an awesome choice if you make sure the plates and tanks are done. ANY make/model with interior plates requires maintenance regularly (bedding). We absolutely LOVE our 2005 Island Packet 370 and are very often the only ones out on the water because she takes heavy wind like a boss, when that same wind keeps the Beneteaus at the dock. The IP is incredibly rock solid, which I'll take over winning races any day. We chartered a Beneteau in the Caribbean and were laughing at how early we had to reef when the wind speed was increasing. If you want a cheap boat that can't handle heavy wind and with interiors of particle board and veneer, buy a Beneteau. You can still have fun sailing it!

[jimmystacy]

I purchased my 1990 Island Packet in 2018. Yes I knew the chainplates needed to be replaced with 316L and the factory had guys at the marina replacing the chainplates that week. No problem, and she is basically just like a brand new boat, other than all the upgraded electronics. There are few other brands I would consider.

[jamesweaver]

My 1984 IP 31 has chainplates that are non magnetic. So its unlikely that they're the least expensive 304. When/if they need replacement, I'll switch to titanium external plates. The hardest plate of that project is removing the interior to access the existing chain plates. Although the easy solution would be to leave the old ones in place, i wouldnt want corroding metal inside the hull.

Remember that adding external chainplates means adding a backing plate for each chain plate! I would heartily recommend comsulting a metallugical engineer for recommendations before starting the project so you get the best possible material for external corrosion resistance, the proper bolts and backing plates to avoid galvanic corrosion.

[thylacine]

As usual your research is impeccable. Very informative episode.

[captainrehab]

BTW 304L is made for improved weldability and has less Carbon. It is not stronger or more corrosion resitance. 316 adds Moly for corrosion resistance but still suffers from crevice corrosion ( just replaced all my shackles after 10 years due to corrosion of the pins). an Alpha phase Titanium would work but the old Naval bronze would too.

Retired Mechanical Engineer and Materials Scientist

[beorbeorian]

Wow - watched so many videos on island packet and this issue has n it come up. Good information. Saving my pennies for a boat when I retire. Island packet is top on the list.

[WillNGo]

Hi Tim (from the South China Sea! a day out of Subic Bay. Stick that pin in your fan map.) That $18, 000 number is interesting. In many cases it might be a "Well it's time to sell the boat" number. Not so much, 'let's dump this on the next owner, ' but just the last straw in a fading sailing career (age mostly, divorce, kids grown up...) as in, Sure $18k is doable.... but what'll the next $18k be? Factored in buying such a boat isn't being burned. If the potential owner is aware it's just a factor. (How many great boats were purchased as 'needs work, ' or as salvage and the new owner(s) had the sweat equity to turn a problem into a boat they might not have been able to afford. I can immediately think of Expedition Evans, David Shih, Parlay Revival, Sailing Trieteia, there's a long list. Just these four YouTubers wound up with amazing boats mostly for sweat equity. Two Lagoons! a Beneteau and a 'real' boat an Allberg, but now all solid.)
I think the two factors are 1. What will have to be done? and what will it cost? but critically 2. Who's going to do the work? Is this something we can DIY or do we need professionals? And is there anyone in our area? And when can they do it?

[johnhairston]

Owned a 1986 IP 38 that we bought in 2009. Had a refit done in 2015 and made the decision at that point because of all the commotion to have the chainplates replaced. When they were removed, the old ones they looked as good as new with nary a sign of corrosion. What are you gonna do with that point though? I remember being somewhat perturbed at all the hysteria.
But yes, the biggest problem is that they are glass them and you can’t inspect them.

It was a fantastic boat otherwise and safely took us places. It was nowhere near as slow as the reputation, but maybe that was just our setup (asymmetrical on the top down, furler for light air.)
And it’s true, we were out and comfortable when it was gnarly, and all the other production boats stuck in the harbor.

[familyatsea]

A machine shop will do that for a fraction of the price. 316 will still get crevice corrosion, a lot of people are switching to titanium as it doesn't suffer from this.

[jeffp]

From Jerry Swartz at IPY:

The question of how likely there is chainplate corrosion on the Island Packets is dependent on both the material used and the maintenance of the sealant under the chainplate covers. There is really no way to determine how well the sealant has been maintained over the years so the only clue available is the material. The material is not dependent on the model or model year but on the time when it was upgraded.

Before early 1995, the chainplates were built using 304 stainless. From early 1995 to early 1999 they were built using 304L, which is a more corrosion resistant grade. From early 1999 to present they are built with 316L, the best of the three grades. Over the years, various improvements to the installation procedure, such as eliminating a fiberglass cover over the chainplates, so as to allow any water that gets in to drain, were implemented. At one point, IP started having the builder of the chainplates anneal the metal as part of the manufacturing process.

The gray area in all this is that when the material changes were made, IP did not keep track of the hull numbers that got the improved material and there was no guarantee that parts on the shelf were rotated. Sometimes two or more models had the same design and some of the new parts could have been used up while some old parts were still on the shelf.

Going from 316 to 316L was an improvement but not as dramatic as going from 304 to 316. Having said that, there is no way to check the integrity of the chainplates without removing them so if you do that you may as well replace them. Keep in mind that with poor chainplate cover maintenance, even 316L can corrode. It just takes more time.

[dennism]

A great deal of info.
Keep up the good work

[twanda]

Really exceptional episode! I like learning about good and bad of various boat brands. I see it as an opportunity to just know more and be a better educated buyer/viewer/dreamer.

[mariossaraiva]

Best sailing channel so far! You sir do exactly what you claim to do, help more people feel confident about getting in the water. Learning so much from your channel

[kurtsteiner]

Having served i n the Royal Navy inthe uk. I know about stainles steel and other material at sea.. it sets up electro acid action corrosion. Therw are ways to offset this, one by fitting sacrificial diodes to the offended area you just replace the diodes not the unit. Another is to put an electric low level charge through tge hull, eithe the whole hull or offending areas, this is expensive.

This occurs when alloyslike stainless steel and aluminium come i contact with ferrus metal like mild steel and bave contact with sea water.

Hope it helps

[rosewood]

Great video. I think the reality is that all stainless on any boat that lives in salt water becomes suspect after 15 years. The Island Packets are way stronger than most although perhaps not as strong as people might think if they use displacement as a guide because they use concrete not lead as ballast. Ie lead lower has greater righting moment than concrete. So you have use more weight to achieve same result. I have disassembled many stainless bolts especially and found deep black fissure electrolytic corrosion. And there may not be rust streaks. For me the answer is simple. My boat relies on being able to sail off a lee shore in bad conditions. Check the chainplates and renew anything that's critical.

[BlackheartCharlie]

Thanks for a well balanced presentation of the issue.

I own a 1988 IP38 and have sailed her many thousands of miles. I'm going to switch to external chainplates - the condition of the original internal chainplates is unknowable. I don't have the comfort level that I used to in 40+ kt winds that the boat is not going to have a problem.

[SaltyDougSailing]

I owned an early 90s Island Packet and kept it for… 18 years! Yep, it was the longest relationship of my life. :) As you mentioned, the safety and quality aspects were my primary purchase decision factors. When I sold her late last year, the chain plates were certainly a focus of the buyer. Unfortunately, there is no way to inspect the chain plates without opening up the boat. Proper maintenance of the bedding was essential. Keeping good records of all that maintenance is what helped alleviate the concern.

[CommentRedacted]

Love these video's Tim. As a new sailor myself this type of information is beyond priceless. Your delivery is always spot on. Keep up the great work! I'm really looking forward to getting my Hunter 23 in the water for a full season this year; I only bought it last year and only got a couple weeks sailing in.

[waltobringer]

Words of wisdom from this guy....last time, this time and every time. Cudos!