LDS Church Financial Apologetics w/ Spencer Anderson [Mormonism Live: 173]

On this week's program we take a look at the Faith matters Podcast with Aaron Miller where they answer the 100 Billion Dollar Question. But do their answers hold up? We sit down with Spencer Anderson to get his perspective on whether these Financial Apologetics hold water or if Miller is just blowing smoke.

RESOURCES:

[millie]

The FCC report stated the LDS church's own internal auditing department told them they were not in compliance. They absolutely knew.

[nancyevans]

Any lawyer that advises someone to do illegal stuff should be disbarred.

[ajadamsv]

My mission president worked for the church in Brazil his entire adulthood. He fell into hard times financially yet couldn’t receive assistance from the church because of some policy between the government and church. I was approached by a former companion to help. He was a good man to me in the mission field so I agreed to a substantial amount monthly. As time proceeded I began to question why the church wasn’t helping? I was astonished by the response. Anyway long story short it’s frustrating that a wealthy church couldn’t assist even a devoted member. 1:43:24

[utahman]

"The growth is happening where there is no internet."

Let that sink in for a while.

[KSASTAMPS]

This discussion points out a wider issue in the culture: Please explain why any entity gets to reinvest their profits tax-free in financial investments? Why doesn't every individual, group and organization have to pay the exact same tax rate on capital gains? If you as an individual were allowed to not pay taxes and recycle all that money in high-return tax-free investments, you'd become wealthy in short order too--you wouldn't have to be a genius to do it. If every entity had to all contribute equally to capital gains, the rate could be dropped for everyone--probably to 5%-10%. Ideally, there wouldn't be any capital gains. The wide moral issue in the church is this: the church has a legitimate necessity to pay the real operating costs of the church, plus a buffer for hard times (perhaps 3 years savings for operating expenses). Beyond that the leaders of a church have a mandate (from the scriptures--remember those?) to use the tithes & offerings expressly (and ONLY) for the relief of human suffering. But what the leaders do not have is a mandate to use tithing funds as seed capital for profit-making ventures--where in all the standard works do they have a justification for this? When the LDS came to the valley in 1847, they almost starved to death several times for the first 25 years of so, before there was any economic stability at all in the region. With the establishment of the railroad (and mining), activities which BY initially vigorously opposed, finally there was some stability. I believe there was justification initially for the LDS people to press hard into temporal concerns that helped achieve this stability. But the church has not had its economic life threatened for over 100 years now, but the leaders apparently can't avoid the temptation to continue to prioritize the interests of Mammon by being deeply entrenched in profit-making activities, all at the expense of the hapless tithe-payers. Cmon leaders you can do much better: if you can't figure out how to pay down this monstrous pile of resources, then do the right thing and GIVE IT BACK to those who have paid into the system for decades.

[thelastgoonie]

They consulted lawyers AND the lawyers advised against it AND they continued anyway. So in their statement, they can say lawyers were consulted. It doesn't say they FOLLOWED it.

[ron]

You guys need to have Spencer on as a guest more often. Smart, level-headed guy!

[thelastgoonie]

They weren't trying to avoid taxes...they were trying to DECIEVE THE MEMBERS.

[Richfam-clho]

This entire episode was a mic drop!! I loved every second. I wish every member would listen with an open mind. My TBM Mom's comments on the SEC issue was this, "the church got in trouble, as I understand it because of an accounting error that many have made because the forms are complicated and it was an accountant who missed it, not the church. The minute that it was brought to the church's attention, they paid what they owed where most businesses try to get out of it or at least drag it out."

I just can't even with that comment. So much wrong with it, but of course I have to just bite my tongue.

[whitesalamander]

Thanks for shining light onto the secret combinations of the Gadianton Robbers, even Russell Nelson, Dallin Oaks, and Henry Nosering.

[ron]

Ok, let me see if I'm getting this right...
It's the one and only true church, but we need to save money dishonestly for the 2nd Coming. Hmm... Doesn't seem to add up.🤔

[DoctorWithoutDogma]

It seems like I read about this somewhere… “Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.” James 5:3 KJV

[michelledutra]

Not only did it grow during Covid but like you talked about the under developed countries, or less developed countries, they denied assistance to faithful members who have and continue to give their all. My husband and I have personal friends in Brasil who lost their jobs and needed help the church said no and in the end they lost their home. They have been missionaries, bishops and stake presidents etc. it’s infuriating

[landon]

Moral licensing: Brigham Young, unlike Joseph Smith was not a visionary. He didn't believe that God spoke to him, but rather, anything he did had God's stamp of approval. If he didn't have that stamp of approval, God would stop him. That's why Brigham preferred the moniker President of the church more so than prophet. He was a megalomaniac waiting for God to stop this thirst for power and money.

[tlgallego]

Missionaries are great salesmen, bringing in new donations to the Ensign Peak Fund... Hopefully the class action lawsuit will allow Missionaries to be paid for the work they did!

[evez]

The church is moving forward no matter what

[ron]

RFM states "The church is not run by prophets, but is really run by lawyers..."
Reminds me of the ending of the movie "The devil's advocate".
Al Pacino "the devil", talking about the need for innumerous numbers of lawyers.

[RichardHolmes-llii]

What is your response to the reality of Paul Gregersen debunking the arrogant Egyptologist opinions against Joseph Smith?

[kennethd.]

Yay for getting funny Mormon commercials on the Mormonism Live. 😄

[zackc]

When you have more money than Smaug you probably should cut a few dollars lose to pay custodians.