Romans 8: Does it support the Calvinistic doctrine of Total Inability?

Dr. Flowers walks through Romans 8:1-14 to demonstrate how it cannot be used as a proof text for the Calvinistic concept of Total moral inability (The T of the TULIP).

[cdenese]

i have been searching for years for good resources from non reformed viewpoint. very hard to find. we do appreciate you Leighton!

[JohnQPublic]

Superb video. Another wonderful exposition on the phantasmagoria of Reformed Theology heterodoxy.

[plumber]

I just want to say thank you Leighton for your work and efforts.

[dorothyhinkel]

God makes sense and his plan makes sense. He is not willing that any should perish but that all would be saved. Christ died for all. God is perfect justice. He gives everyone a fair shake. Simply believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.

[histruthunfolding]

Leighton, I completely agree with you on the historical attitude of Calvinists towards those who disagree with them.
But the same is also true today.
Most of my interaction with Calvinists has been much like standing up to a bully.
They seem to have little or no concern at all about the feelings of their fellow brethren, let alone their fellow man.
I truly believe that if it was legal to persecute and punish those in opposition, Calvinists would still be doing it today.
We all must take a stand against this tyranny.
I love them, but I cannot stand how they operate and how they treat others.

[helgeevensen]

so spot on ... very important points in the last part... :-)

[R.L.KRANESCHRADTT]

My best friend, an Bapt elder of 25yrs, (correction-25yrs/deacon... the new pastor changed it to 'elders' after he got hired) in his lifelong traditional/provisionist church had just resigned his eldership over this exact issue.. they accidentally hired a new pastor who failed to advise them of his Calvinism... and who doesn't even give an alter call anymore....

[lilyduck]

Wow. I came for Romans 8:1-14 but a random rabbit trail of Dr Flowers just upended a life long support of the death penalty for me? I've never thought of it that way 😳

[n.holt]

Calvinists fail to account for the fact that Paul defines works in Romans 3 as "deeds of the Law." Faith does not fall in that category and therefore their arguments for faith being a work are irrelevant from the start but then further denied by the fact that faith is constantly contrasted with works and the Law showing that God does not view faith as a work.

[christian_gamer_guy]

I think one thing we need to do is to call calvinism heresy, because it is. It puts our sin on God, takes away our responsibility, and distorts the very bones of the gospel. It's not Christian.

[n.holt]

That was the true Light, which lighteth ▶every man◀ that cometh into the world.
John 1:9

Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, ▶I am the light of the world:◀ he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life. - John 8:12

[JoshStribling]

Lol, slight slip of tongue at 12:12...
"How do you go from being in Christ to being in Adam?"
Thankfully we know what you meant to say there by the CONTEXT!
Haha, love you brother!

Of course we all know that it is the other way around, that we go from "being in Adam to being in Christ, through hearing and believing the gospel".

In all seriousness...
Thank you for your faithfulness towards God in taking the time to walk through the text to clearly show others the truth of God's word with careful study.
Scripture is always consistent when you interpret scripture with scripture, and not force contrary ideas into the text that are supported only by cherry picked verses taking out of their original context.

[R.L.KRANESCHRADTT]

1:08:00 People on average people will eventually begin to treat others in the same manner which lines up with how they believe the God they worship will, would or does.
Calvin unapologetically killed people labeled heretics believing he was doing God a favor by saving him the time.
He never repented of this.

[EricLucero]

1:09:55 - In a matter of a few sentences, Leighton just convinced me to flip 180 degrees in my opinion of the death penalty. How is it that, being a Christian for nearly four decades, I've been pro-death penalty the whole time? How did I not understand that succinct point Leighton makes here? Bravo sir. Thank you for serving our Lord and holding true to His Word, which is all about LOVE.

If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet known as he ought to know; but if anyone loves God, he is known by Him.
— 1 Corinthians 8:2-3

If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.
— 1 Corinthians 13:2

Anyone who truly understands love as the Bible teaches it, understands that God embodies this such that He was willing to suffer and die on the cross unjustly so that the rest of us might be spared a just death, cannot abide by the teachings of Calvinism which suddenly become utterly ridiculous in comparison.

Love all people, because God loves all people, and we are made in His image.

[heidirobinson]

Thank you for your videos!! However, I do learn quite a lot from James White & Jeff Durbin, regarding God & His teachings.

[MyRoBeRtBaKeR]

The passage of Jacob and Esau do not claim God loved or hated either of them. It merely says they have never done any good or bad. How could they? They were only a forethought.

To say God hated Esau is to say that God planned for Esau to be unable to find repentance even though he would seek it with tears.

[n.holt]

I disagree. Romans 8 is contrasting ▶walking◀ in the Spirit verses walking in the flesh. It is talking to believers. It is the believers whose carnal mind is emnity with God(not to the exclusion of the lost persons carnal mind). It is the saved persons carnal mind that cannot be subject to the Law of God. It is the saved person who will die if he lives after the flesh rather than after the Spirit. Paul is talking about walking not Salvation in Romans 8 as he has been in the past few chapters(6 and 7). It is the walk of the saved person that Paul is concerned with here as he has already dealt with Salvation and justification in chapters 1-5.

V1 There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ AND walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit. I am not a KJVO but the KJV gets it right here. There IS condemnation to those who are in Christ if they don't walk after the Spirit. Just ask the Corinthian who was committing fornication and got his body delivered unto the Devil for the purpose of destroying it. Oh wait...he is dead. There is much mamuscriot evidence for this reading and it indeed causes doctrinal problems without it and doesn't give the proper context of the chapter being about the walk of a carnal believer versus the walk of a Spiritual believer. Evidence will be below in the comment part.

V5 those who live according to the flesh. That is talking to believers. If u believer are living in a immoral way then your mind is set on immoral things but if u walk after the Spirit then your mind will be set on spiritual and moral things. This is not contrasting lost versus saved it is walking after the flesh vs walking after the Spirit.

V6 The carnal mind of the SAVED person is death but the Spirit is peace and life.

V7 The carnal mind of the believer is emnity with God and cannot be subject to the Law of God.

V8 Now it references lost people. The lost cannot please God In their WALK bc that is what the entire chapter has been talking about. Paul does not have faith in mind here. It is the same kind of pleasing God going on in 1 Thessalonians:

Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men:
1 Thessalonians 2:15

The Jews did not please God in their walk.

Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.
1 Thessalonians 4:1

Paul tells the Thessalonians that they should please God in their walk. It is this kind of pleasing God that Paul has in mind. Not having faith but walking in the Spirit. The lost cannot do that, they do not please God in their walk.

Wait! No Leighton, that is EXACTLY what Paul is saying here. Paul is talking to born again Christains saying "For if ye(he is talking to those who he just said were in the Spirit) live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live."
Romans 8:13 parentheses mine.

Brother u are so close to what this passage is really saying even looking at 1 Cor 2 which speaks of a similar thing.

V12-13 If u walk according to the flesh u will die but if u kill the deeds of the flesh by the Spirit than I will live. We are not debtors to the flesh.

Alright brother, u acknowledge that this is talking about believers so now be consistent and realize that the entire chapter is about the believers.

No. It doesn't mention how one becomes in the Spirit or the flesh bc that isn't what the chapter is about... But Calvinists usually don't realize that. In fact there is only one verse that even mentions a lost person in the entire chapter bc it isn't about lost vs saved.

[n.holt]

I believe most non-calvinists are only so bc they are ignorant of soteriology in general. I guarantee 90% of the people at my church probably don't know what Calvinism is really. It is time that Bible believers make a stand against this false doctrine b4 it is too late. We need to start committing the Word of God to faithful men and women who are able to teach others also. It is time to speak up and make changes.

Yep. Bible believers, we got to do better than quote John 3:16.

How about we just let the Calvinist have their way in the SBC and start some strictly non-calvinist organization? If the SBC is really 95% Calvinistic in its leadership then what do we have to lose?

[jeffreybomba]

Something else I think causes a lot on interpretational problems is what I call brethren theology, and 1Cor 3 is a perfect example. If Jesus specifically told the Apostles NOT TO PULL THE RARES because they would mess it up, and Roman’s 2 say we can’t condemn, and Romans 10:6 says not to judge one’s eternal destiny, then why do we assume Paul is declare salvation by using the them brethren? Could 1 Corinthians 3:1 be saying these people are “And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh (not saved false professors OR)as to infants in Christ. (saved but immature).

[n.holt]

Hmm. Not sure if I agree with your statement on the death penalty bc not only was the death penalty under the Mosiac Law but it was around long before that as well. God told Noah, he who sheds man's blood by man shall his blood be shed. I am not opposed to mercy but mercy has it's limits. Even God commanded the death penalty for the Corinthian BELIEVER in the church when he had sex who I presume to be his step mother. Nevertheless I respect your opinion and u aren't going to lose me bc of that. It is good to be merciful. It is good to have justice served. It is a balance. We see God have mercy and we see God have people put to death. We see that the death penalty comes straight from God but we also see God is long suffering. We see that the government does not wield the sword in vain but we see that those who judge without mercy will be judged without mercy. As God I believe that we should not delight in the death of the wicked but as God we should not allow the wicked to go unpunished. Perphaps u think that prison is enough but one cannot deny that the death penalty was instituted by God on several occasions both under and not under the Law. I think we could cite many passages where God destroys someone bc of their wickness and we could probably find equally as many where God spares someone that deserves to die. Regardless I can't speak for others but I still love u brother.