Why the Brotherhood of Steel is Problematic

The series' darling, the Brotherhood of Steel has the tech, training and discipline to take on any challenge, but this fan favorite has some big problems. What are these issues and how bad could they possibly be?

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Timestamps:
Paradoxical purpose: 1:19
Dogma's downfall: 10:15
Inability to govern: 17:33
A flawed foundation: 25:55

[SixWingZombi]

The only mechanized faction I trust in Fallout 4 are the Atom Cats.

[kotzpenner]

I’m not a big fan of retcons but I really like the evolution of the Brotherhood in terms of politics. They went from a group of survivors to a secret knightly order to a technological power player to a theocratic dictatorship with strong personality cult.

[BoisegangGaming]

I don't necessarily think it's wrong for the Brotherhood to be portrayed as hypocritical. Many religious orders and fanatical groups will often become so dogmatic that their initial mission or ideology is buried under tradition.

In fact, I think that can make them more interesting, as we've seen the Brotherhood constantly struggle with the idea of doing what's right versus what's dogmatic, such as in the FO76 storyline. It's possible there might be a schism that occurs in one chapter and ripples outwards to the rest of the Brotherhood.

The mission and ideals of the Brotherhood is noble, but it can often become patronizing or isolating. I think writers should really juggle with this rather rather just saying "they're hypocrites so they're bad".

[mattieguilliams]

@ 19:50, factual error:
Paladin Danse says that "the east coast chapter of the brotherhood of steel went through one ineffectual leader after the other, " following Sarah Lyons death. Arthur was simply the latest one at the time of Fallout 4. It's not specific how many other elders were in between Sarah Lyons and Arthur Maxim

[OmegablueWolf]

i really wish there had been an outcast faction in fallout 4....'Lyon's Pride' or 'Lyon's Knights' or something that we could choose to support and help claim leadership instead of Maxsons 'the Enclave with better PR' faction.

[Warrior-Of-Virtue]

This is why it kills me that the Midwestern Brotherhood was de-canonized. They were by far the most innovative and adaptable of the chapters we've seen. A simple rewrite would easily clear up the conflicts with the current canon. For example, move the events of Tactics to after the events of Fallout 2. This would make it so that the Brotherhood's encounter with the Enclave and the realization that they are no longer the technological big dogs in the Wasteland was the catalyst for the schism that saw the formation of the Midwest Chapter. Next, seeing as ED-E's recordings confirm the presence of Enclave in Chicago, make them the main antagonists instead of the Calculator because, let's face it, if a robot army like that had existed in prewar America, its remnants would be everywhere, not just in the Midwest. You could even make it so that the reason the Brotherhood crashed wasn't because they flew into a storm, which makes them seem pretty negligent, but were shot down by the Enclave. And the reason their power armor starts to look like a hybrid of Brotherhood and Enclave armor is because it is. They would start using components taken from the armor of dead Enclave soldiers to repair and upgrade their own armor.

[ThomasSpettel]

This is the irony of the BOS, they started out as survivors of the military army, but over time and new generations later, they forget their origins and it's various members are split on their ideology.

[theweppeofficial]

_"With self planned righteous causes come self centered mindsets."_ - Brotherhood Steel in nutshell

[davidhoopes]

Okay yeah they’re flawed but look at this - *insert cool power armor and liberty prime *

[Strattios]

I think they should become more Monastic Knight like, ie: Templars. Some of their rigidity works, it gives them character. But I think a better way to do it with minimal tweaks is this: Their capital and main bases are fortified labs that have towns of non knight citizens around them. They fight to protect the citizens, and the citizens farm and produce goods for the Brotherhood. People can join, but have to accomplish a quest first. Ghouls and super mutants can live in their regions, but have to fight in auxiliary units to prove loyalty. They still raid for tech, but use it to help their citizens also (better meds, generators, purifiers, etc). The brotherhood is good, but it does need to account for growing population and think this is a good way. Make them the nobility to a post apocalyptic society.

[Nobody-zlkk]

The brotherhood is the embodyment of the mentality of "Rules for thee, not for me"

[srobin]

I wish Lyon’s group was a more permanent one that actually decided to split off from the main brotherhood faction. Creating their own version of it, it could add a more humanitarian, but flawed faction to the wasteland.
Maybe it can be done in the future where we learn Lyon had some followers who kept his ideas to heart.

[danieldragotti]

I'll give Lyons this, he's the first leader of the bos to relise there causing more harm then good

[Balevolt]

I was just thinking of the Brotherhood today, mainly wondering why they didn't do Operation Paperclip 2: Electric Boogaloo with the Institute instead of nuking it

[neoluna]

If only Sarah Lyons had survived, I think she could have fully realized the vision her father had, I really hope that her death is retconned at some point, say like how the fallout 4 quest mod Project Valkryie does, where she faked her death and left to premt a coup against her as the rank and file become more and more radicalized, turning into what they became in fallout 4.

[petergerman]

I believe that Sarah Lyons is still alive. The only reference to her death was a single line in a terminal in the Prydwen.

[gioflores]

Can you speculate if the Midwestern brotherhood of steel is active? In New Vegas Ceasar mentions they captured brotherhood scribes further east that didn't know the name of the founder of BOS. Can this be the Midwestern BOS?

[daynemora]

The point you made about the BoS opposing the NCR because they were a threat to the BoS's dominance over the region provides a better explanation for why the Arthur Maxson east coast chapter opposes the Institute. Selling it as a kind of holy war instead of a consolidation of power ensures that the rank and file will be more invested in the pursuit.

[lucashlicata]

Cancel culture has come for the brotherhood of steel

[spudzzy]

Babe wake up, RadKing just posted a new video