Why Most Indie Game Developers Don't Make Money

Join me as I chat with the original indie game publisher, Scott Miller!
► Thumbnail art, I sadly couldn't find the artist... let me know in comments if you find!

[thomasbrush]

I just love how honest Scott is during this podcast. Let's give Scott a huge thank you in the comments for hanging out with us!

[iamthebubb]

I'm making a game because I've always wanted to, I will release it and I don't expect it to make any money, It's been fun and horrific all at the same time

[WeenieWalkerGames]

I'll also add in something I think gets overlooked by many indie developers: treat your game as we suggest gamblers do when entering a casino. Don't bet (spend on development) more than you can afford to lose! Not everyone can quit their job to make their dream game, and that is perfectly acceptable. Like Scott says when discussing movies, not every movie will be a hit, but you know what? It is a lot easier for a movie studio to make their money back on an $8 million budget vs. a $200 million one! (Ignoring, of course, the asinine way movie studio accountants do the books where even the most highly successful movies technically "lose" money.) Pulling it back to games, focus on making a game that only needs to sell a smaller number of copies to be successful. Plus, from a marketing perspective, it should be easier to get a connection to a small group of fans and then grow your reach with that core group from a prior game hopefully willing to give you a chance on your next project! Someone from Y Combinator once said in an interview to not start at scale; meaning, do things that you can't do when you have a million customers but which will be the life blood of your project when first starting out. The example given was AirBnB, where the founders literally went to New York City and offered to take pictures of hosts' homes personally for the website. Obviously, they couldn't do that in every new city, but when they first started out and were trying to reach 50 homes on the site? Well worth the effort! For games, find a fan community for the type of game you want to build and join it, but not just to promote your game - get involved in the community, be an active participant, and become an established part of the group. Because then, when you do promote your game, they will see you as an actual member of the community and be more open to giving you a shot as you are not just someone seeking to market to them. (Obviously this only works if you are making a game that you yourself are a fan of, but that is a different issue to discuss elsewhere.)

[eteriumgames]

Making games is something like writing...you have to make several games before you really have the right experience.

[PneumataGame]

I love that he points out that you have to always keep learning, and be open to learning. Growth mindset until the end :)

[aeDRK]

This video is literal GOLD MINE for Indie devolopers. Insane work and interview! Kudos.

[Ironlionmn]

What’s crazy is the people working at the school in the computer lab are getting paid about the same amount but the cost of living has increased dramatically

[Alexindiegamedev]

I love how honest you & Scott are in this video thank you for the information on this video during my own indie dev journey Thomas.

[koalabrownie]

"The first independent games" didn't come out in the 90s- they came out in ziplock bags in the late 70s by someone like Richard Garriot working in his bedroom.

[fauxshowyo]

Watching this channel I'm constantly unsure whether I should keep trying to make games or give up now since it's all "hey thousands of games come out and you need to spend 10 years practicing first to make a dime" lol

[I-OMusic]

I love how you broke up the full interview into a bunch of smaller, edited videos with your own commentary to give context.
Like these recent videos have been so rich with info, and it's really interesting to see how yours and scotts experiences differ

[wmblemania]

The role of LUCK is grossly under-represented in game development.
We all like to believe we're masters of our own destiny, and that we'll make money if only we work harder. But it doesn't work like that.
Steam is full of great games that don't sell. They don't get sequels because their developers go broke, usually with huge debts.
For every indie darling whose game is promoted by all the fashionable streamers, there are a thousand other developers who work just as hard, whose games come and go, just one of the thousands of games that hit the digital shelves each year.
Remember this in your business plan.
DON'T BET THE HOUSE ON ONE GAME.

[oliveoil]

hey Thomas! another great video. i just wanted to say that i absolutely love the format of this interview that you are uploading. i know that this is the same interview from the last video but i very much appreciate that each video is one question rather than getting thrown a bunch of information at once. it allows for proper absorption of the information he is giving. thank you!

[solitudeau]

Do you ever have drops in motivation? How do you get back on track?

[vklymenko]

What we are missing these days is a web portal where programmers, artists, game designers, musicians can log in on daily basis, upload a piece of work every time, working for free but have a fair % of income after project published. Its up to you to participate in this or that project and have risks to loose your time and efforts, but you have no pressure, you can work on 20 projects at the same time, don’t wait anyone, no publishers (maybe portal itself can be the publisher as well). Anyway I hope this guy will make it some day, I’m a professional game developer, but not an entrepreneur.

[alexquinn]

This is what i fear if i run a indie game company

[jolantakazlauskiene]

Unfortunately it's a rough market out there and indie devs, especially indie solo devs, are unlikely to make much money. The kinds of games one person can make in a year are unlikely to sell well.

[FreeFlowOfficialLLC]

FIRST! also Thomas. I've lost motivation for game dev. But you've given me the inspiration to carry on! Thx!

[wmblemania]

FYI: "Indie games" predate Wolfenstein3D and Duke Nukem by a long way.
Most computer games prior to the DOOM years, were created by indies.
They were created by very small outfits, often just as single programmer/artist.
For every Electronic Arts with their venture capital, there were a thousand programmers, bashing away on their Apple II's, Commodore 64s, TRS-80s, academic mainframes etc.
There is no single first "indie" creator. (Even Pong has a backstory that crosses decades.)
Cheers.

[MariJadeWrites]

Thank you for this video :) I am working on a game idea slowly, mostly for myself since it's my first game. :) will see if I eventually make more games.