Did the Quran exist early as a book? A discussion with Dr. Asma Hilali

Special guest Dr. Asma Hilali joins Dr. Brubaker for a discussion of her latest research as well as her earlier research related to the Sanaa Palimpsest, and of the topic of variants, variations, and the fragmentary nature of the evidence and state of the field of Quran and Quran manuscript studies.

0:15 Introduction
1:05 Intro
1:15 Q: "What are the big questions?”
1:22 A: 1) The original text, 2) The quranic variants, 3) The chronology of the Qurʾan. Searching for the oldest mushaf is based upon assumptions given to us by the secondary sources. We now have greatly improved source material, but we are still operating on the mindset of past generations. The field of quranic studies is in need of renewal of the conceptual framework for studying the Qurʾan
4:55 Q: "What are some of the surprising features that you have found in early Quran manuscripts?"
5:10 A: Dr. Hilali clarifies that she is not primarily a manuscript scholar; manuscripts for her are a tool, rather than an objective. Her study of the Quran manuscripts has spanned the past ten years and stemmed from a concern that the transmission of religious material should be considered as a whole. Somehow in this process she found herself in front of the Sanaa Palimpsest and editing quranic material. What surprises her most (7:30) is that, despite this deep interest and activity related to the manuscripts, we still do not have the Uthmanic muṣḥaf. The muṣḥafs do not exist, or at least we don't have them, nor do we have the Companion codices. This is true for both Sunni and Shia Qurans. So, we have to think about the meaning of this absence. We are referring to concepts, but we still do not have the material Quran. But there also there remain many non-edited manuscripts.
9:30 Q: “What can we make of the absence of the exemplary codices/muṣḥafs?"
11:07 A: Hilali mentions Michael Cook’s article which establishes the probable existence of the regional muṣḥafs. So, the issue is that we don’t have the material Qurʾan.
11:50 Q: What questions are prominent in Hilali’s research now?
12:06 A: Most interested in the relationship between the different religious genres. We are talking about the pre-canonical period, during which the transmission of the material all took place in the same context and was carried by the same actors. Knowing about this might also inform us about the tools of canonization. The Quran has never been isolated (14:50) from other texts. We debate about the relationship of the Quran to the biblical material, etc., but there is a larger pool of material too.
15:20 Q: Is there anything beyond that general pool of biblical material (e.g. Christian and Jewish, and its various sects, literatures, and variations), that you believe is relevant when we come to the Qurʾan?
16:42 A: I am very curious to learn how the various materials interact beyond the levels of composition and textual analysis, but rather at the level of the people and the actors, and how the learned milieu grew, and where, and in relation to which kinds of political decisions or institutions. Among other things (18:30) we may want to know who were the translators [i.e. of the biblical materials into Arabic (19:20)].
19:50 Transition to discussion of the Sanaa Palimpsest
20:50 What is a palimpsest?
22:00 Nature of the variance in the upper and lower texts of the Sanaa Palimpsest, and nature of the variance between these and later manuscripts. Hilali’s book an edition, not full development of a new theory. Others (including Elisabeth Puin and also Behnam Sadeghi) have also made editions of the Sanaa Palimpsest.
26:20 Hilali talks about her opinion of the Sanaa Palimpsest as not intended to be part of a codex in the first place. She did not succeed (27:15) in reconstructing various passages in ways that aligned with (for example) the codex of Ibn Mas’ud, as did some colleagues.
28:55 Discussion of the term “variations” versus the term “variants.” The term “variant” implies a standard, a reference point.
29:25 Hilali’s opinion that the Sanaa Palimpsest page was not intended to be conserved. In addition to the quality of the page, there were orthographic errors made on fols 6a and 9b (30:5).
30:20 Discussion of the “reading instruction” la-taqul bismilla (Don’t say bismillah) on 5a, at the beginning of Sura 9. She believes context was dictation, and that this page was not intended to be conserved in a codex.
31:45 Brubaker comments and response.

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[ReasonedAnswers]

Thank you Dr. Brubaker and Dr. Hilali for having the courage to make this important information public. Muslims need to be exposed to truth and make their decisions about whether they want to believe in Islam based on truth, not fantasy.

[edwinooo]

Bottom line: standard narrative has holes in it.

[davidmelander]

Thanks to Dr Hilali for adding to the knowledge base. Of course, her work raises so many interesting questions that scholars will be digging into for years to come. An open discussion is what we all hope for.

[djaflo]

this vid should be an obligatory subject for imam studies...
always a great joy to see quran (& hence islam) being discussed on an academic level, unbiased, with such an extended factual and historical knowledge.
also thumbs up for Dr Asma Hilali

[Soothsayer]

Very interesting conversation.
Also thx for the Time Stamps. Much appreciated!!!

[worldchanger]

Thank you Dr. Daniel for this priceless information you put out.

[kingbaldwiniv]

Thank you both for the discussion, the level of honesty discourse is rare.

[VeeduVidz]

The standard narrative has holes in it

[epenisapaongo]

The first Islamic scholar with the correct approach of how to study the Islamic texts by studying all material as whole Quran, Hadith, etc, etc...I wonder how long before the Islamic scholars shut her down..

[imboredlols]

She says two important points:

1. She is not an authority in this subject, and she is looking at it as an outsider. She is expert in other fields.

2. Her finding is that this copy is a student copy who used it to learn and therefore may have made changes to his understanding. She believes this is not a copy that is used for practice or in mosques.

This manuscripts is proving the authenticity of Quraan and th fact it is not changed overtimes. The second text is relible. The old text is more of a student using this material for learning and practicing.

[suavecito]

Thanks, I like the video. Interested in learning about the Quran in a educated level.

[arkan.rahmadian]

Good, informative and educating video. God bless you Dr. Dan and also Dr. Asma for making my day.

[richardthornhill]

Truth is never threatened by research of those seeking truth. Lies of deceptions are threatened and oftentimes intolerant.
It is good to ask questions. God encourages men to seek and know. Religion demands acceptance of its clerics and its dogmas.

[Zulkuf]

Quran is perfectly preserved right down to the letter.

[isusjebogisaija-]

LORD JESUS (YESHUA) Is The KING 👑 Of The JEWS (Isaiah 53), (Psalms 22) and (Zechariah 12 : 10) ! GOD Have a SON (Proverbs 30 : 4) and (Psalms 2) ! The MESSIAH will be Born in Bethlehem on Earth (Micah 5 : 2) ! The MESSIAH will be GOD in Flesh on Earth (Isaiah 9 : 6-7), (Isaiah 7 : 14) and (Micah 5 : 2) ! YESHUA IS MESSIAH ❤️ (Daniel 7 : 13-14) ! YESHUA Will WIN For us and Israel 🌍 Last Battle Armagedon (Zechariah 14 : 4) ! You must be Born Again with Holy Spirit 🤗 .

[Niles-Guy]

Sir your channel is growing . Congrats 🎈🍾 and hoping you reach 20K soon. Hope you invite Muslim scholars to your channel to have a lively discussion. But please like more comments from your viewers ..😉

[ArthurCor-tsbg]

Erasures in the Manuscript was not intended for preservation but change.... The traditional Narrative is without basis

[littleboy]

Daniel, could you please raise the volume of your videos? Your voice is so melodious and gentle and so little bit more volume is required. Thanks for your scholarly works.

[pathebeast]

Partially because of technical issues with the audio and the language barrier I don’t think most of the comments reflect that people understand the video. This comment is for the Muslims that think Brubaker is using some missionary tactic vs academic work in his past videos. Dr Hilaili is a Muslim and she holds the belief that the Sana’a were student learning aids. Respectfully Brubaker argues against that and with good reason. It just goes to show you can have sincere discourse without intellectual dishonesty and cognitive dissonance. I do wish she had brought a better support for that theory than the one she provided.

[ErnChildofJesus]

Excellent Topic, Thank you so much for sharing these videos.
God Bless