China Refuses to Back Down - Is that a Good Thing?

Huge thanks to @BrighterwithHerbert for joining the discussion.
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Links from today's show:
China Passenger Car Association: New energy passenger car market retail sales in August reached 1.027 million units, up 43.2% year-on-year

BYD has increased its annual sales target to 4 million units, Morgan Stanley auto analyst Tim Hsiao said in a research note yesterday, citing comments from BYD's management. That compares with the company's previous estimate of about 3.6 million units.

China’s economic planning agency is setting up a nationwide test of vehicle-to-grid charging to see if the country’s massive fleet of electric cars can be used to smooth out peaks and troughs in electricity supply and demand. Under the trial, all provinces will be asked to nominate one city to set up a V2G system — where electric cars can feed power back into the grid during times of high demand.

#Tesla #TSLA #EVs

[jackwaters]

Enjoy the banter with you and Herbert🤗I started with a Prius plug in, and after 2 years and only one tank of gas, realized the folly of 2 drive trains. Now have a Fiat 500E, 4 years in and 0 maintenance ( 2 jugs of washer fluid) Canada loves your videos.

[rctezluh]

Hybrid's aren't real, at the end of the day they are still an ice vehicle, Having said that these advances in China sure do put a smile on Herbert's face!! Mine Too!! upvoted!!!

[doug]

Thanks for pointing out that Hybrids have 2 ways to Catch Fire! So Exciting!

[machoopichoo]

I have said a few times, I suspect with NEVs in China, the more rapid growth of PHEVs vs. BEVs is due to lack of charging infrastructure. In Chinese urban areas, over 90% of people live in multi-tenant dwellings such as apartments and condominiums. So, it is likely that most PHEV owners are using their cars as mild hybrids but enjoying NEV incentives. I can't imagine the CCP allowing this to continue indefinitely - it would effectively make PHEVs mild hybrids and defeat the purpose of plug-in EVs.

[erhuforever]

BYD's latest generation PHEVs are getting around 80mpg in real world driving conditions, and these family sedans are selling for around $12k USD. This is giving consumers really great options.

[charlesrovira]

@11:11 *V2G* in *India* is going to be bolstered by these two factors:
1: *India* has an _enormous_ population. There are more people in the middle class, educated, smart, and willing to go all-in on V2G in *India* than in the *USA* or *Europe.*
2: Most vehicles in *India* are not owned by _individuals_ but are _leased_ by _corporations_ who are forever looking for ways to reduce their *_tax burden._*

[futo]

3:00 that dip in the chart is Chinese News Years or they would refer it as the Spring Festival always occur around this time, late Janurary to Feburary according to the Lunar calendar, and every business not just the auto industry experiences a deep drop when they close down for entire week national holiday

[casperhansen]

I know some people driving plug-in hybrids, they love it, especially driving the electric part, they charge it at home and then at work and uses electric only for their daily commute, I guess they realize it's stupid when they need a full service of the engine

[MrGMawson]

Cheers guys you seem to know more than me 😆

[jorgenjohnson]

The worst thing about hybrids is people have such a bad experience with hybrids breaking down all the time because they have more moving parts that they refuse to go electric after that they associate the problems with the hybrid to all battery electric vehicles.

[jackcoats]

After getting solar and Powerwallls at our house, we really wish we could get a retrofit for our Model Y to allow V2G

[drayc]

Going v2h on Cybertruck is slightly over $4300

[andrewf]

Some of the Chinese "hybrids" are all electric drive trains with gas engines that function as an on board generator but aren't tied into the drive train. Kinda cool if you really need that but I think they are a temporary bridge to full BEVs for all the reasons you mentioned and more.

Getting rid of hybrids entirely just requires better batteries and charging infrastructure, which are already more than good enough for most daily use cases in most places in the world with lots of passenger vehicles.

But Out of Spec recently documented terrible wait times for non-Telsa charging in Southern California because there isn't enough charging stations for the demand (exacerbated by ppl charging to 100% when they really shouldn't and a high percentage of stalls being offline). That problem would be greatly reduced with more level 2 chargers were many of those people live, work and recreate. No brainer to charge EVs when they are not being used instead of wasting time charging them when you could be doing something else.

[Regenme-iosk]

If most of the vehicle owners in China do not have charging capabilities at home because most live in apartments how are they going to transfer the energy from the vehicle to grid? Perhaps getting the cart before the horse so to speak!

[kevtheobald]

Maybe an aftermarket company, like UP!, might make some sort of retro fit for Model Y and 3, to give them the vehicle-to-grid ability. Just seems like there are plenty of them out there. If just 5% do the retro fit, it would probably generate good revenue for UP!

I do think Tesla under values that feature. Hope the next major refresh of the Y includes vehicle-to-grid ability.

[MrGMawson]

BYD are still trying to get shut of hybrids

[chimbo]

Are the Chinese drivers using the hybrid cars correctly? The typical western driver has been shown not to, but you make the point about heavy carrot and stick environment

[Alopen-xbrb]

Won’t cars back feeding power to the grid wear out the batteries over time? Also if the Chinese government is doing it, consumers won’t be compensated properly. They will be told what they get for involuntarily“allowing” use of their battery.

[jackcoats]

Parallel hybrid is pretty bad, serial hybrid can be much better. The old BOLT was serial hybrid and so is the new Edison big truck. Serial hybrid allows a little smaller batteries, and the ICE portion is just a small generator, at least it can be much smaller than the otherwise required ICE drive train.

[TheRoon]

My son in law bought a hybrid about two years ago and lately the company that sold it to him wanted to buy it back for more money. He won't sell it but his mother drives electric and my daughter is looking at electric.