Jimmy Akin Vs. James White – The Predestination Debate

Jimmy Akin engages in a spirited debate with James White on a protestant radio show. He engages in a refutation of Protestantism with White, the perennial anti-Catholic.

#CatholicDebates #CatholicApologetics

[CHEKPNT]

Tbh I like Mr White but Truth does not contradict. Jimmys does have the best compiling arguments and very well thought out.

[mchurch]

So Jimmy Akin asks the million dollar question: "why would a doctrine like this go undiscovered for 1500+ years?"
White responds with a dissembling, diverting comment on papal infallibility.
I wish he would answer that one - because that's kind of key to the entire plausibility of protestant theology as a whole.

[steveimhoff]

Jimmy Akin rocks. He’s brilliant. Out smarts James White over and over.

[cb]

Mr White seems to be more interested in puffing his chest than intelligently refuting Aikin soundly.

[markofied]

I do not recall a time when Jimmy, Trent, Staples or any other CA men lost a debate. Catholic doctrine when studied and learned is undeniable truth. Unfortunately there are no shortage of Protestants with the help of the devil teaching heresy.

[Davematheny]

James White comes off as just anti-Catholic. He's just too sneering - a more charitable person would be a better representative of the Protestant position.

[ttshiroma]

These two put on an awesome debate everytime. Both are learned in there respective denominations and debating skills !!! They throw knockout blows in the nicest tone of voice! Lol

[cb]

White met his professor... so much for that protestant eloquence

[iqgustavo]

🎯 Key Takeaways for quick navigation:

03:24 📖 James White emphasizes the biblical teaching of predestination as unto full and complete salvation, contrasting it with Rome's view of conditional salvation through purgatory.
15:33 *🔄 Akin challenges whether predestination to grace necessitates predestination to glory, arguing that true Christians can fall away despite initial predestination.*
16:12 *📖 The term "predestined" in Scripture refers to both predestination to grace (entering Christian life) and predestination to glory (final salvation).*
18:01 *📜 Akin asserts that true Christians can fall away, a belief historically held by the vast majority of Christians including Augustine, Aquinas, and Luther.*
19:33 *📚 Augustine, in his later years, wrote that a true Christian can lack perseverance, contradicting the idea of unconditional perseverance promoted by Calvin.*
21:12 *❓ Akin questions why the idea that a true Christian cannot fall away remained undiscovered for 1, 500 years of Christian history if it were a biblical truth.*
35:19 *📖 James Akin highlights the present tense aspect in Greek, indicating continuous action in passages like John 6 and 10, suggesting that belief in Jesus must be ongoing.*
37:21 *🛡️ Akin argues that John 6 and 10 do not assert that all true Christians will always continue to believe, suggesting that belief can cease even after initially coming to Jesus.*
39:53 *📜 Akin references Dale Moody's interpretation of John 10:27-28, emphasizing the present linear Greek verbs as indicative of continuous action, allowing for the possibility of ceasing to follow Jesus.*
41:56 *💬 Akin presents the view that being cut off from Jesus (John 15) contradicts the idea that all who are in Jesus will persevere, suggesting one can be a true Christian and later be cut off.*
44:57 *📖 Predestination, as argued by James White, focuses on final and full salvation, emphasizing a personal relationship between Jesus and His sheep.*
45:52 *🙏 True and saving faith, according to Scripture, is a divine gift that will not fail, bestowed by God to those predestined for salvation.*
46:33 *🛡️ Those predestined to salvation are given the gift of abiding and remaining faith, ensuring eternal security in Christ's hands.*
47:31 *💬 Jimmy Akin highlights two types of predestination: to grace (initial salvation) and to glory (final salvation), citing Ephesians 1 and Romans 8.*
48:13 *📜 Akin argues that true Christians can fall away, countering the notion of perseverance of the saints advocated by White.*
49:06 *📖 Akin sees predestination and election as closely linked, with all genuine Christians elected to grace but not necessarily to glory.*
50:17 *📚 Akin emphasizes efforts in faith, warning against deception and mortal sin, urging an honest church community for spiritual safety.*
53:18 *🌐 James White clarifies that his position represents Calvinism, not a universal Protestant view, differing from many other Protestant denominations.*
01:06:38 *📜 Individuals within congregations, sanctified by Christ's blood, can be lost, contradicting the idea of unconditional eternal security.*
01:07:30 *🙏 Pastoral responsibility involves prompting true repentance, not just telling everyone to abide in Jesus.*
01:07:56 *📖 Plain scriptural testimonies, like 2 Peter 2:1, conflict with limited atonement and the perseverance of the saints.*
01:08:36 *💬 A caller challenges by citing Hebrews and Romans, emphasizing the need for perseverance in faith.*
01:10:27 *🛐 A discussion emerges on salvation: grace vs. human actions, highlighting contrasting theological views.*
01:10:57 *💬 Salvation's assurance lies in Christ's grace drawing believers continually to salvation.*
01:12:36 *📚 The debate contrasts man-centered vs. God-centered religion, focusing on the sufficiency of grace.*
01:14:56 *🏛️ Purgatory is viewed as the final stage of sanctification, preceding entry into heaven, not a place of eternal punishment.*

[DrChaunceyBlevins]

James White sounds like a Nickelodeon show host

[onesneak]

Crazy how Protestants quote early church fathers knowing that those fathers were catholic. I urge all those struggling to understand the body and blood of Christ to read the early Church Fathers. To study history is to cease to be Protestant.

[LetsgoB]

I would like to thank James White for helping me find the Catholic Church. When I see people misrepresent something I tend to go the opposite direction.

[markgraff]

An early Slamdunk for Jimmy don’t call me James

[gainsofglory]

What I don't get about White's position is that if I wasn't chosen, what exactly do I do?

Just kind of shrug and say "well, guess I'll just sin then".

And how does God carry out selecting these people while taking in 0 input from them at all, and then decide to condemn so many? He wants all to be saved, so what is preventing that if our choices aren't involved?

I'm just coming into this. My faith isn't very strong at all, its an effort I am under taking. I could easily just turn back around and call it a day and not try. I could just go back to seeking pleasure. If I'm chosen, God will turn me. If I'm not chosen, I'll have a blast and die and then get shipped off hell which I was going to anyway.

Odd theology.

[YuriBoechat-efts]

01:13:33

It is disgusting and repugnant how White is able to take advantage of the obvious lack of time at the end of a debate to launch a machine-gun attack on highly complex issues, which he knows his opponent will not have time to respond to, and which has NOTHING to do with the epicenter of the topic under debate.

[brendanbarry]

James white isnt protestant or catholic .
Hes calvinist
Calvinism breeds Athiesm
Love and blessings

[ridgerunner]

First. Oh, and Dr. White is correct, God won, Rome lost, per the usual.