An Interview with a Former Calvinist Friend

Dr. Leighton Flowers has an old college friend, Brad Wilson, on the show to talk about his own journey into and out of Calvinism.

They also go over some recent exchanges on social media to bring clarity to our actual vs perceived theological differences...and make a book recommendation that you don't want to miss!

Finally, they will take listener questions that pertain to soteriology.... JOIN US!

[LizCanKnit]

God saved me from Calvinism and He used Leighton Flowers to set my feet on the path away from it. Praise God!

[fightintheshade]

Well done Brad. It takes a real man to admit he was wrong. God richly bless you.

[aquinasrost]

Very good discussion. I too embraced calvinism while pastoring in California. I attended MacArthur's church, did an internship there, and later attended 7 Shepherd's Conferences. I no longer embrace calvinism, but I will say i still appreciate and listen to MacArthur. My departure from Calvinism was fundamentally influenced by what I concluded was the system's inability to deal rationally with the problem of evil. Then the issue of meticulous sovereignty was the final blow and I realized the system is totally irrational and cannot be reconciled with the general testimony of Scripture.

[ruthgar]

The best discussion so far for me. Your stories of what drew you into Calvinism. I entered Seminary without being a Calvinist. Southern inundated us in the Doctrines of Grace. We were taught that we had to be some sort of Calvinist 1-5 points. I knew I could never be a 5 point. I attended school to learn to explain the Gospel better. I wanted to take preaching and evangelism classes to be a practitioner.
So, where did I get caught up and hurt by Calvinism? First, it was more about indoctrinating us and not helping us get a fundamental understanding. We only had Calvinists recommended to us, and others received disdain. Looking at the Bible, I knew the full-blown 5 points wouldn't hunt. But what attracted me to the Election part was my evangelistic mindset.

I struggled with why a person wouldn't hear the Gospel just rejoice and receive it. In my salvation, I remember God clearly convicted me and convinced me one particular night. So in my mind, I wanted to reconcile why so many reject Christ. So it made sense that, in general, we were so stubborn that we would always fight the Holy Spirit and needed God to decide to just go ALL-IN on some people. Now I didn't believe God meticulously determined us to be hardened. I looked at it as part of the Fall and free will. I bought into the mindset that the curse and Fall was kryptonite to even the ability to recognize our need through the Gospel. I also never believed that God wanted people to burn in hell. I just thought there was something in His nature that would not push most people beyond a certain point.

But because I only had Calvinistic and Arminian views on the election, I left Seminary without a place to hang my hat. The basic assumptions of election in both those systems are VERY depressing and challenging. So in my confusion, I would get a hard heart towards people who rejected the Gospel. I would try to figure out if they were just people God WANTED to pass over. When I read Paul wishing he could be accursed to reach people, it created anger. Then I came across the James White Acolytes and got bit by them. I struggle with being upset when a person pushes Calvinism in manipulative or condescending ways. Brad shared the confusion he just bought into as a Calvinist. My issue is that I saw the cognitive dissonance but didn't know where to turn to have reasonable options.

Long post to say, THANK YOU LEIGHTON! Thank you, Brad. So So So helpful.

[TheOtherCaleb]

His point about seeing Calvinism everywhere is so true. Even as someone who has never been a calvinist, once you know and understand the doctrines, you can tell where they pick verses from. And honestly, sometimes I have a “determinist scare” (as some call it). I look at a text that seems to teach determinism (due to the never ending determinist yelling in modern Christianity) and I get stuck in my own mind about it. Though they can be explained with proper understanding and context, I still see them in their Calvinistic twisted forms. The ideas of Calvinism have poisoned my mind into seeing something totally different than real scripture. Calvinism is eisegesis at its very core.

[GoldStandard]

Thank you Brad for sharing your story and thanks Dr. Flowers for giving him the platform. It is great to hear from someone that honestly considered the issues with Calvinism. My Calvinist friends seem unwilling to consider any theological position unless it's calvinism and unfortunately stay trapped in their own echo chamber.

[gwenlucas]

Brad's testimony really touched my heart! So informative, loving, kind and humble.

[benvindatati]

Thank you for being persistent on discussing this issue. Calvinism has a stranglehold on so much of Christian content online.

[carlgove]

This is such an excellent broadcast Leighton. What a way to start the year. Brad has excellent character and is hitting the heart of the issues. Thank you for having him and doing this.

[ruthgar]

An incredible friend gets shocked, but his first response is "Hey I need to pray for my friend..." What a great testimony.

[rangerj]

Thanks for your openness and willingness to share your experiences men. A great video to kick off the new year with. May God bless you both.

[michellebaran]

I love this! I also don't think Scripture teaches Calvinism - I also think Calvinism does not reflect God's true character, as it is revealed in the Bible. I think what you're doing with Soteriology 101 is so important!

[sonnyh]

Flowers has caused me to doubt my positions over the years. Sometimes my brain would be locked up and I would just have to quit listening for a while. My mind says that I want the truth no matter how inconvenient, but my prideful heart wants to be right and not wrong... it's a battle that I was losing for a long time. I used to share the gospel up through my twenties. After being exposed to Calvinism close to 30, I didn't know for sure about what the Gospel was so I didn't share because I didn't want to tell someone wrong. I took the verse about misleading little ones seriously, so I remained silent. I've wondered if this wasn't a scheme of the devil to distract some from sharing the Gospel because it was working on me. I was not as gentle or loving as I used to be. I can't say for sure if it was because of Calvinism because anyone can go through a dry season or backslide. I've kind of taken the position that I may never figure this out, but I've got to get back to sharing the Gospel, , and I see nothing wrong with asking people to choose to repent from their sin and follow Jesus. If they get saved... does it really matter for me if they chose or if God opened their eyes or if it was some combination thereof? It seems more important that I love more and serve more. I used to think that I had a lot of things figured out... boy was I wrong. I would've make a good Pharisee because I liked knowing and following "the rules" but there wasn't much love in what I was doing. Calvinist circles taught me to be almost like a movie critic except everything and everybody was the movie. Today, I'm not a 5 point Calvinist thanks to God using Flowers. I'm somewhere in the middle realizing that I need Jesus more than ever.
It is problematic that Calvinists seem to avoid his questions which causes more doubt. I like to hash out these things like the other guys and have some "iron sharpening iron", but I've been out of balance over the years, and I think many Calvinists are as well. Flowers exhibits gentleness more so than White. They are both smart and intelligent, but White comes across a jerk and sadly a lot on both sides have worn the mantle... of jerk, but it just seems like more Calvinists tend to be prideful because they think they have the "revelation of truth" while the other side just seems a bit more grounded. That's my experience from an Arminian independent baptist church, SBC church, Reformed Presbyterian, and a PCA Presbyterian church. I was wrongfully excommunicated from the PCA by an authoritarian and am now in a SBC church. The excommunication got me asking questions and trying to figure out what happened and why. I stumbled onto Layton and my mind was open to listening and here I am listening some more.

[KimDroptiny]

You did a great job Brad. Thank you for joining Leighton's podcast. I've never been a Calvinist but found this episode so interesting - especially the part about the lady in your church who said she'd never return to your church because it was Calvinist and your inner urge to sort of shade the truth. That caused me to realise the importance of speaking truth at all times! (Of course in love and kindness). Thank you Leighton - you are a gift to the body of Christ!

[primeobjective]

Many years ago, the introduction of Calvinism by a friend led me to a theological identity crisis. I was absorbing Sproul, Piper, MacArthur & White.

Disturbed by the logical conclusions they refused to acknowledge, I turned to research, study & prayer. Ultimately, their logical contradictions started flooding my mind, where I rejected their systematic in its totality.

Calvinism is another invented false doctrine from the fallen mind of man.

[juliacozicova]

thank you for this very intelligent guest. God bless you both!

[julietleblanc]

Terrific interview! Just ordered some coffee as a thank-you. I really appreciate this channel, God bless you guys 💕

[jesuscross]

I love Brad's humility that he was willing to question himself. I pray all the time "Lord please reveal to me anything I believe that is contrary to your word." I used to be adamantly opposed to the doctrine of eternal security of the believer. I had many proof texts, but my favorite was Hebrews 6:4. All ES believers I had encountered would try and tell me that these people in this verse were never true Christians. Because anyone can plainly see that they are, I thought I was justified in rejecting the doctrine. Then one day the Lord had me listen to a pastor who affirmed ES and also that these people in Heb. 6 were Christians. Long story short, he pointed out that I had been reading into the text that they had fallen away "from salvation" when that's not what it says at all. That realization caused me to go through and examine every single one of my proof texts and to my shock I realized I was reading that into every one of them. So I can see how the same thing could happen to someone stuck in Calvinism. Always be willing to re-examine your position in light of new evidence. God's blessings to you.

[kimberlyn.]

Thanks for this! I was asking my older brother about Calvinism yesterday. He was able to give me some information but this helps so much!

[tobieaina]

You describe my experience accurately around 43:00! So true. I found myself in Calvinism by moving away from prosperity gospel.