Christian Nationalism Panel | Voddie Baucham, Tom Ascol & William Wolfe

This panel was presented by Dr. Tom Ascol, Dr. Voddie Baucham and William Wolfe on January 18, 2023 at the IOPT Pre-conference on Christian Nationalism, preceding the 2023 National Founders Conference in Southwest Florida.

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[antredevers]

The interviewer asked, What is Christian Nationalism?

And for 41 minutes they poorly attempted to define the term or movement by what its not. It’s not a theocracy, it’s not a theonomy…etc. However it’s a country where God’s moral law is implemented by Christians. Their vagueness begs the question.

I’ve loved listening to Voddie for years now, and he’s known for his articulate exactness concerning what he thinks, those two attributes were missing in this interview.

[bluemm]

What YOU mean by Christian Nationalism and what THEY mean by it are two TOTALLY different things and it is usually a trap. James Lindsay explains this exceptionally well.

[kate]

Excellent. God will build His Church for His Glory. Live Holy. Fear God. Obey Him in all things.

[freegiftgospelmissio]

Family-rod
Church-keys
Government-sword

[stevebrandau]

i'd like to see the panel respond scripturally to what the Christian Nationalists believe rather than what others believe about them.

[tahuyachris]

But, God never told us Christians to rebel against the ungodly government. The Roman government was doing the opposite of what the government was supposed to do as laid out in Romans 13:3-7. And, God still told the first Christians, in 13:1-2, to submit.

[tazlizard]

I am so glad to hear this conversation! Not long ago I was called a Christian Nationalist I did not know how to respond because I had never heard the term! All I know is I don't agree with the world's view on abortion, gay marriage and transgenderism!!

[questioneverything]

John McArthur did a sermon called "when the government rewards evil and punishes the good" the best sermon I have heard to date regarding government, Roman's and the church.

[georgeluke]

If our culture's presupposition on "Christian" is pejorative, should we on that principle say, "it depends"? 

Or, should we begin "Yes. Let me tell you what I mean by it."

[richardwhite]

I am a Christian and have been one for over 60 years. My father was an American Baptist Association minister.
Whenever I encounter anyone that they want the United States to be a Christian nation or say they are a Christian Nationalist, I ask them "Do you mean a Methodist nation? A Presbyterian nation? An Episcopalian Nation? A Roman Catholic nation? An American Baptist Association nation? A Southern Baptist nation? A Disciples Of Christ nation? A Congregational nation?"
Once they get over being stunned at my question, they usually claim that all of the Christian denominations I mentioned are not Christian and the only Christians are the those people who follow their particular, specific variant of Christianity and only their variant should be acceptable in the United States.

[clifforddunn]

If by the term Christian Nationalism you mean literally obeying The great commission..sign me up..I'm all for it.

[lextalionis]

It is inconsistent for Ascol to ask someone to define what they mean by “Christian Nationalism” but to refuse to ask what they mean by “theonomy” when asked either question.

[PastorJerett]

I'm a conservative biblical Christian who happens to be a patriotic conservative American citizen. I believes we need to go out and make disciples for Jesus Christ. It is by making disciples that we create a Christian nation. I also believe as an American that I need to know our founding documents, founding fathers, and founding history. The Declaration of Independence and the United States Constitution are the most important documents for our country. As Christian, we should vote with our biblical values.

[mikejames]

This is sad to see, we need a movement to rebuild Chrisendom, starting with America. Everything they're saying is what pastors who, like them are correct and Biblical in their general beliefs, have been saying for decades while things have gotten worse and worse. We see where this form of Christianity has gotten us, and it's time to change back to what built Chrisendom in the first place, which is the exact opposite of where these men stand on this issue.

[chadmartin]

That was phenomenal and beautiful! Thank you

[traceyedson]

I’m finding these discussions & presentations helpful. I’m Orthodox (as in “Eastern”) and the Church has a somewhat different take. Yet, a major difference would be in the local church as “Christian.” Orthodoxy teaches that the Church is literally the Body & Bride of Christ, and believers should, through faithfulness & repentance, seek to attain unto that. The “Christianness” of the Church doesn’t derive from believers but from the Spirit that I dwells Her. That would make the Church a much more vivifying & sanctifying presence (leaven, salt, light) in culture. But we’d arrive at basically then same place and these esteemed gentlemen propose.

[dannisivoccia]

I am a disciple of Christ Jesus, and i am called to love my country God's way.

[tahuyachris]

In Hebrews 11, the Holy Spirit gives us examples of faithful, godly living, which we should follow. In verse 13, the Spirit says that these examples counted themselves as strangers and exiles on the earth. And, in verses 15 and 16, He says that they did not consider their earthly nations as someplace to be returned to. But instead, they were seeking a Heavenly kingdom and therefore God was not ashamed to be called their God. Jesus told us the same thing in Matthew 6:33, seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness.

[dmustakasjr]

If you listen to everything that Greg Bahnsen taught on Theonomy, from its definition to the application, it is inescapable that the modern "general equity" recognized as a fulfillment of what Dr. Bahnsen taught. Bahnsen was no legalist with regards to the OT civil law, he used it as an example, and argued to modernize its application wherever it made sense through "the moral nucleus" of the ethics of the law. It was the penal sanctions that I believe that modern church leaders have the biggest problem with what is recognized as Theonomy, over and against either GE or Christian nationalism.

[David-kdrw]

Not sure why Voddie thinks only baptists are opposed to a state church. Joe Boot, a presbyterian, has written much on this