Mohammad Hijab and The Trinity || Anthony Rogers

Anthony Rogers joins Hatun to review the Trinity debate between Mohammad Hijab and William Lane Craig that took place @CapturingChristianity
Jesus is LORD
John 20:31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name

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[truthdefenders-]

Excellent review, best one I've seen. Get Rogers back more often.

[jamalkhan]

Great stream. Thank you for doing and sharing. God bless you both.

[SoYouAreB]

I loved the explanation of the Holy Trinity from Anthony Rogers. God bless you both. .

[PhilHoraia]

From my post, Samad

In this version of Ibn Kathir we read: وقد ذكر محمد بن إسحاق وغيره أنهم كانوا يعبدون أصناماً فصنم يقال له صمد وآخر يقال صمود وآخر يقال له الهباء And Muhammad b. Ishaq and others mentioned that they used to worship idols and one idol is called Samad and another is called Samud (or Sumud) and another is called Al-Hiba’. تفسير الآية 68 إلى 73 من سورة الأعراف تفسير ابن كثير

[sugami]

Originally I thought WLC bringing up Tawhid was a misstep as not the topic and is therefore a Whataboutism, however he is a seasoned debater so he probably did a bit of research on Hijab and knowing Hijab wouldn't be able to leave a challenge unmet, he took the bait and wasting his time debating something he didn't need to debate. And as Anthony pointed out, Hijab does a pretty poor job defending it as well 😆
Hijab's two matches = bigger candle flame fail made him lose the debate. Nevermind he spent half his time strawmanning WLC's position and doing a pretty poor job trying to poke holes in the Trinity 😂

[PhilHoraia]

My post, A Brief Look At S 112

1 Say: He is Allah, one of, 2 Allah the Samad. 3 He did not beget nor was he begotten. 4 And there was none good enough for him.


On ahad ‘one of’, I refer the reader to Sam Shamoun’s article Monotheism vs. Eloquence of the Quran


For ‘Samad’ see my post Samad


In Arabic لم lam usually introduces a past tense signification, so when we read لَمْ يَلِدْ وَلَمْ يُولَدْ we may translate as above.


Verse 4 says: وَلَمْ يَكُنْ لَهُ كُفُوًا أَحَدٌ For kufu see this page: كُفُو - Translation into English - examples Arabic | Reverso Context Were Islam true, Allah might have since found something ‘good enough’ for it.

[mysotiras]

Mimi Hijab made a complete fool of himself in that debate. Why waste 2 + hours of your time on him?

[QueenQaffir]

I couldn’t watch the “debate.” Hijab just annoys me into illness. However, bc I tried and fast forwarded more than anything I, too, noticed reactions from William Lane Craig and laughed everytime he made a face, which was nearly everytime clown man spoke, and looked like “what the hell is he talking about”.

[PhilHoraia]

My post, 'Ibn Maryam' As a Denigration of Jesus

In quran Isa is called 'the son of Maryam' some 23 times. Now in the Bible and among Christians Jesus, called Isa in quran, is called 'the Son of God'. The author denigrated Jesus to the role of a mere messenger, although in one passage he shoots himself in the foot.


S 4:171 People of the Book, do not exceed in your religion nor say about Allah but the truth. The Messiah Isa Son Of Maryam is only Allah’s messenger and his word which he threw to Maryam and spirit from him. So believe in Allah and his messengers and do not say Three. Cease; it is better for you. Allah is only one god. Praise be to him that he should have a child! His is what is in the skies and what is on the Earth. And Allah was sufficient as an agent.


Is the Trinity in the Quran?

Isa, Allah's Word

Isa, Allah's Spirit

Agent Allah

Agent Passages

We Make No Distinction Between Messengers


In the following verse the author says:


The Messiah will not disdain to be a slave of Lah’s nor the angels, the Muqarrabun. And those who disdain his worship and are arrogant, he gathers them to him, all.


The Muqarrabun


For the author Isa is not a son but a slave.


Allah, Master or Slave?


Muslims will say that the Jews cast slurs on St Mary but in ancient Israel at least a man was not called 'the son of [X mother]' unless his mother was a widow or his father was unknown. In Islam, Maryam (supposedly St Mary) never married. Supposedly the talking baby story cleared Maryam (supposedly St Mary) of having been a slag.


Isa in the Cradle


There is a big question mark over the author's legitimacy, with his birth having apparently taken place four years after his alleged father's death. No other prophet, real or otherwise, in quran is named after his mother or even his father. Would Muslims be happy were the author, the 'generous messenger', to be referred to as the son of Aminah?


A Messenger’s Speech?


When speaking of the notion of Allah's having a child, the author uses the word walad, which suggests a physically begotten child, and not the word ibn (son). Elsewhere the author has no problem with referring to a traveller as a 'son of the road'.


Walad:


S 2:116 And they have said: Allah has taken a child. Praise be to him! Rather, his is what is in the skies and the Earth. All are obedient to him.


'Taking' a Child

Qur'an Contradiction and Error: Are they all obedient and prostrating?


S 4:171 People of the Book, do not exceed in your religion nor say about Allah but the truth. The Messiah Isa Son Of Maryam is only Allah’s messenger and his word which he threw to Maryam and spirit from him. So believe in Allah and his messengers and do not say Three. Cease; it is better for you. Allah is only one god. Praise be to him that he should have a child! His is what is in the skies and what is on the Earth. And Allah was sufficient as an agent.


S 6:101 The originator of the skies and the Earth. How can he have a child when he has not had a girlfriend? And he created everything. And he is a knower of everything.


S 10:68 They have said: Allah has taken a child. Praise be to him! He is the rich. His is what is in the skies and what is on the Earth. You have no authority in this. Do you say about Allah what you do not know?


S 17:111 And say: Praise be to Lah who did not take a child and did not have a partner in the dominion and did not have a protector from vileness. And magnify him with takbir.


Protectors (Awliya')

A Partnership Made in Hell


S 18:4 And to warn those who have said: Allah took a child.


S 19:35 It was not for Lah that he should take any child. Praise be to him! When he decides a matter he only says to it: Be and it is.


Kun Fa-Yakun Be and It Is


S 19:88 And they said: Al-Rahman has taken a child.


S 19:91 That they have invoked for Al-Rahman a child.


S 19:92 And it is not seemly for Al-Rahman to take a child.


S 21:26 And they said: Al-Rahman has taken a child. Praise be to him! Rather, honoured slaves.


S 23:91 Allah has taken no child nor was there any god with him. Then every god would have gone with what it had created and some would have been lofty over others. Praise be to Allah from what they ascribe!


S 25:2 The one whose is the rule of the skies and the Earth and has not taken a child nor has had a partner in the rule and created everything and made it an estimate.


Allah Created Everything?


S 39:4 Had Allah wanted to take a child he would have chosen from what he creates what he wills. Praise be to him! He is Allah, the one, the oppressing.


S 43:81 Say: If Al-Rahman had a child I would be the first of the worshippers.


S 72:3 And that he, exalted be our lord’s good luck, has not taken a girlfriend or a child.


'Taking' a Child


'Taking', i.e adoption. An adopted child has of course been physically begotten. But of course an adopted child becomes the adoptive parents' son.


S 112:3 He did not beget nor was he begotten.


A Brief Look At S 112


Further reading:


Allah the Physical Being

[PhilHoraia]

My post, 'Taking' a Child

The Quran in a number of places speaks of Allah's being said to have'taken' and not having 'taken' a child.


S 2:116 And they have said: Allah has taken a child. Praise be to him! Rather, his is what is in the skies and the Earth. All are obedient to him.


S 10:68 They have said: Allah has taken a child. Praise be to him! He is the rich. His is what is in the skies and what is on the Earth. You have no authority in this. Do you say about Allah what you do not know?


S 17:111 And say: Praise be to Lah who did not take a child and did not have a partner in the dominion and did not have a protector from vileness. And magnify him with takbir.


S 18:4 And to warn those who have said: Allah took a child.


S 19:35 It was not for Lah that he should take any child. Praise be to him! When he decides a matter he only says to it: Be and it is.


S 19:88 And they said: Al-Rahman has taken a child.


S 19:92 And it is not seemly for Al-Rahman to take a child.


S 21:26 And they said: Al-Rahman has taken a child. Praise be to him! Rather, honoured slaves.


S 23:91 Allah has taken no child nor was there any god with him. Then every god would have gone with what it had created and some would have been lofty over others. Glory be to Allah above what they ascribe!


S 25:2 The one whose is the rule of the skies and the Earth and has not taken a child nor has had a partner in the rule and created everything and made it an estimate.


S 39:4 Had Allah wanted to take a child he would have chosen from what he creates what he wills. Praise be to him! He is Allah, the one, the despot.


S 72:3 And that he, exalted be our lord’s good luck, has not taken a girlfriend or a child.


The author has people say that Allah has 'taken' a child; he denies it. If people had said that, what might they have meant? What might the author have meant when he says that Allah hadn't 'taken' one?


S 17:40 Then has your lord chosen for you sons and taken from the angels females? You say a great speech.


S 43:16 Or has he taken daughters from what he creates and chosen sons for you?


S 12:21 And the one who bought him from Egypt said to his woman: Honour his abode. Perhaps he will benefit us or we shall take him as a child. And thus we gave power to Yusuf in the land and that we might teach him of the interpretation of ahadith. And Allah is victor over his affair but most people do not know.


S 28:9 And Fir’awn’s woman said: An eye anti-inflammatory for me and for you. Do not kill him. Perhaps he will benefit us or we shall take him as a child. And they do not perceive.


Would Yusuf have been fathered by Al-Aziz and Musa by Fir'awn and even by their 'women', or adopted?


It would seem that the author had the notion that Christians were saying that Jesus was adopted. But he also comes out with the following:


S 6:101 The beginner of the skies and the Earth. How can he have a child when he has not had a girlfriend? And he created everything. And he is a knower of everything.


S 21:17 Had we wanted to take a ‘fun’ we would have taken it from us if we were doers.


If Isa was said to be adopted, why does the author introduce the notion of sexual intercourse? Couldn't Allah have adopted? The author in S 39:4 says that had Allah wanted a child it would have chosen from what it creates.Why doesn't the author in the other passages speak of Allah's not having a girlfriend?


The Jalalayn for S 21:17 say:


Had We desired to find some diversion that which provides diversion in the way of a partner or a child We would have found it with Ourselves from among the beautiful-eyed houris or angels were We to do so. But We did not do so thus We never desired it. [altafsir .com]


Where might this child be found among 'ourselves'? Perhaps among the thousands of boys that would become perpetual servants?

[SoYouAreB]

Molly Hijab is going through Menopause

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Well said brother hijab 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲 thy hve no knowledge of our beautiful religion islam no one can beat brother hijab when it comes to our beautiful religion islam may Allah almighty bless guide an protect brother hijab 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲🤲🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Please don't mock Nabi Muhammad peace be upon him 😡😡😡😡

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

I'm a proud Muslim lady an I love our beautiful religion islam 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Jesus peace be upon him is a true prophet and messenger of Allah almighty 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

What is Rogers talking about omw 🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦👎👎👎👎

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Islam is true an out holy Quran is true no ifs or buts Allah Hu Akbar 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Rogers and his girlfriend i mean that lady have no knowledge of our beautiful religion islam 🙂✌️🤲🤲🤲🤲🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

No one can beat or destroy our beautiful religion islam 🙂🤲

[ShireenMorris-wxwf]

Brother hijab did win that debate marshalaah algudulielah 🙂🤲🤲🤲🤲🤲