AMD is Hiding Peak Zen 5 Performance from Intel! (Ryzen 9000 PBO Analysis)

Ryzen 9000 PBO & Thermal Resistance improvements are Underreported...

0:00 Zen 5 Chiplets are CHEAP to manufacture!
1:26 Why Intel Arrow Lake NEEDS to beat Zen 5 in Performance
4:39 Zen 5 runs cooler than Zen 4 at High Power Levels…
5:49 AMD’s Sandbagging Zen 5 by omitting PBO Benchmarks
9:44 Are recent “Unlimited Power” Benchmarks legit?
10:39 Why is AMD being so conservative with power?
13:04 AMD could hold the Gaming Crown for TWO YEARS
14:15 Intel Aloof Marketing Leak

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Broken Silicon [A PC Hardware Podcast] is available on ALL platforms.

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Broken Silicon Logo by Tom.
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2021 Video Intro by Tom & abstractrealism on the MLID Discord

LINKS!!!!!!:

[tomoconnell]

Wow! Tom you really outdid yourself on this one. Complete miss across the board from you here. Don’t think you came close on a single performance claim you made, even after you adjusted them down substantially. Jesus Christ.

[Noxar_cz]

Thumbnail: 23% faster
Reality: 5% faster
Oh what would you know, MLID pulling performance claims out his ahh case No. 984984

[mukiex]

The craziest number I saw was Cinebench multi-core @ 60w. Zen 5 gets about 24k, which puts it toe to toe with M3 Max @ 80w! And at 80w, Zen 5 gets 29.4k! I'm sure it pans out in Apple's favor when you compare full system power, but that a chiplet, DESKTOP x86 beats out a monolithic ARM chip WITHOUT 32-BIT support at the OS/hardware level is kind of insane.

edit: fixed numbers, thanks @askmedov

[juusovalli]

Spoiler they did not sandbag anything.

[jtnachos]

'why don't they just push it harder like intel'
My initial thought was a mental image of Steve from GN pointing at a headline about Intel's degredation issues on a slide and saying 'That's why!'

In all seriousness, the biggest brain thing AMD has been doing, on both GPU and CPU side, is focusing on efficiency instead of Tim Tayloring their stuff as stock settings. We've seen with both Nvidia's gpus (3080, 3090, and 3080ti popping from transients) and Intel's cpus (degredation) that it tends to not work too good. Even AMD got a bit of taste of it when they were optimistic and assumed they didn't need to tell mobo manufacturers that flooding the voltage was a bad idea.

[Heatranoveryou]

amd doesnt need a biggest advantage when they have no disadvantages. theres absolutely no reason to go with intel.

[necrotic]

"People will reward AMD more if they have better efficiency".
I can confirm it. In my country, no tech channels were talking about that it's worth getting Zen4, until 7500f and 7700 arrived. Now AM5 a huge hit, as for ~100-170$ you get modern CPU that you can put in any cheap a620 or b650 mobo. 7800x3d also gets talked about, but for the price of three 7500f's it is a rather tough sell to most customers

[rangersmith]

Lots of equivocation going on here. No way it makes sense for AMD to sandbag on Zen5's potential. First impressions matter, and so far Zen5 is getting slammed by reviewers. Why would AMD want that? No. If Zen5 with a bit more power can beat Zen4 by ~15%, then it would have been released in that form.

Plus, where is AMD's response to all the bad Zen5 reviews? Are they hiding?

[Strykenine]

Hard to say what Intel will do. With Pat in charge (and I still think he's a good CEO for the company) and so many competitors everywhere, they really need to focus on something that can get them some wins in the market. They have so much money, but in the tech world a few lagging generations can be fatal.

AMD barely survived Bulldozer. Intel has deeper pockets, but it isn't 2009 any more.

[janbenes]

The Intel marketing slide at the end is... It's just sad.

[valentinvas]

Ehh... So where is that peak Zen 5 performance right now?

[RU]

Still wild to think that AMD was sooo close to bakruptcy, then played the ZEN Uno reverse card and now we are talking about Intel falling more and more behind.

Wild.

[DOGbackwardz]

Even if Intel outpaced AMD by a full 15%. How much of that would be given up by degradation, bios, security, microcode updates. Legitimately where does the IPC for Raptor Lake launch day even stack up against IPC for Raptor lake today? Downfall, Spectre was pretty much swept under the rug never to be mentioned again.

[Chrissy]

Ah, yes. 7W APU.
You know what, I'm gonna start working for Intel from now on. I want whatever they were smoking when they made those slides.

[stedavid]

Always was an Intel person but with the current on-going issues with their 13th and 14th gen CPUs, and AMD's super impressive X3D CPU's performance in gaming - it's going to be AMD for my next build unless Intel manages a miracle.

[Atilolzz]

20+ % IPC improvements would indeed be awesome!

[Pruflas-Watts]

Watching this video from my AM3+ FX 8350 pile driver Frankenstein PC with a 6700XT running on 16 lanes of pcie 2.0

[handlemonium]

Seems like AMD is not only giving us double the integrated graphics grunt in laptops, but efficiency that gives the Apple M4 Pro & M4 Max and maybe even the M5 a run for the money too!

[ed.puckett]

I was in a Best Buy about a month ago and had a conversation with one of the salespeople about Intel vs AMD. I definitely have the impression from what I've seen that AMD is the best value, and that Intel with its problematic big/little core stuff and typically higher power consumption was to be avoided. He was like, oh no, Intel is much better, much to my surprise. So when you show the marketing materials supplied to retailers at [14:20], maybe I understand now how this person got this idea. Or maybe they just have a lot of Intel inventory to sell....

[instinctblues]

This video aged very poorly. Zen5 performance is no where near where you have claimed it would be.