What if Being born of Water and Spirit is Really a Reference to the Exodus?

It is just not sufficient to form your spiritual identity in the context of only Israel, only the Exodus, only Moses, and the Torah, it is not sufficient. That is the first birth. That is the birth that happens in real-time with people, the thing that gives you your identity. If you are faithful to the Old Covenant, that is insufficient to see the kingdom of God. You must align yourself with Jesus as your Messiah to see the kingdom of God. You must be a willing participant in partaker of the New Covenant. Check it out!

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#Bible #Theology #MichaelHeiser

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[rongopaihiku]

Amen, this is similar to my conversion, born in darkness(resentment anger hate jealousy ignorance violence abuse neglect)my blessing came when i was 40yrs old living by my own understanding (hardship)thinking I was on my own(suffering), long story short single mum for 15yrs, 2 young adults now, chose to be carer of my sickly parent's believing I loved and forgiven them, oh my, ..the lord showed I did Not😔 the first year was like I was dying anxiety high memories flooding back, left job with 30k debt anyway my luggage was getting heavy, I was use to Heavy being a single mum, But this🤯lucky with the help of a cousin who became a Christian in my ear alot, ...one day in my struggle a bill came in knowing I had just lost 200 a week child support daughter turned 18...something came over me like I was having mean panic attack never experienced before...and something made me say Jesus's Name and it was weak my faith was not strong I just called His name😭 🥲at that moment it was like water being poured on my head😭and all my worries and anxiety was gone in a instant...I was so shocked as I sort other help with this problem and those only helped abit, . From that moment I had peace everything I thought I knew just fell away, ...and it was like my eyes were wide open and all wanted to do is know Jesus who He was and IS.., So glad my cousin gave me a bible I started reading researching and on my journey of Salvation 😭😭😭🥲❤🕊🕊🕊✝️🕊🕊🕊4years later I'm so grateful He loves a wretched soul like me🙂🕊✝️🙌

[Eben_Haezer]

Ezekiel 36:25 I will also sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean. I will cleanse you from all your impurities and all your idols. 26I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27And I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes and to carefully observe My ordinances.
Jesus is showing old testament passage where it talks about new birth. Israel is born in Egypt. They were only delivered from there. They didn't born after the Red Sea event. Those israel were born of flesh. They won't see kingdom unless they are born in spirit.
God is the author of it all. Baptism of the spirit will be a new birth. And our sanctification is our water baptism in the spiritual sense.
Titus 3:5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

[knowledgeispowerchannel]

Michael heiser is still alive in our hearts. Thank you Teacher.

[telesharp]

John 3:5 says we must be born of water AND the Spirit to enter the kingdom. If being born of water is Israeli ethnicity, then how can Gentiles be born of water? How can Gentiles enter the kingdom? The parallel verse given immediately after this verse is, "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit" The parallelism strongly suggests that the water refers to flesh. Also, this is Jesus responding to the misunderstanding of Nicodemus' thinking that "born again" is referring to a re-birth of flesh by reentering his mother's womb. So the context of the immediate answer involves a birth of flesh. I think that in this case, context is king.

[wtillett]

Because baptism by water, (burial in water) is the instruction by Peter in Acts, along with repentance, it seems consistent that baptism is the water part of the birth our Lord was teaching. Noah was saved by water which represents baptism, which now saves us, 1 Peter 3:21, Israel was saved through water, by going into the Red Sea on dry ground, they were all baptized together, into Moses, not Jesus. 1 Corinthians 10:2. We are instructed to be baptized into Jesus, and we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, which is the new birth. We rise to walk in newness of life, because in baptism we are buried into death, to put off our earthly self and put on Jesus, who is our life. —— why make it complicated. Repent and be baptized every one of you and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. —- born from above. Acts 2:38

[voiceoftheseventh]

The exodus was not the "re-birth" of the nation of Israel, the exodus was the "redemption", representing the first of the 3 acts God had told Moses He would perform: "I will bring you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians. I will free you from being slaves to them, and I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with mighty acts of judgment" (Exodus 6:6). It was after all of Israel as "One Man" accepted the words of the covenant that there was a re - birth, as Moses and the Levites declared to the people: “Pay attention and listen O Israel! This day you have become a people to the Lord, your God” (Deuteronomy 27:9). The generation that came out of Egypt saw the Kingdom (because they were born -again), but did not enter the Kingdom (because they were not born of water and of the spirit). They were not born of water and of the spirit because they did not continue in the covenant, they turned back in their hearts in unbelief. As it is written: "...they entered not because of unbelief" (Hebrews 4:6)

To be born of water and of the spirit is to "continue in the doctrine of Jesus the Messiah. “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord’, will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father in heaven” (Matthew 7:21). When a person continues in the doctrine of Jesus the Messiah, he is a disciple indeed (John 8:31), for he partakes of the washing of regeneration by the Word and the renewal of the Holy Spirit.

Shalom.

[michelhaineault]

born of water it's born from the flesh Jesus was answering Nicodemus about '' How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!” What is born from the flesh (water) is FLESH!
Jesus came not only with blood but with WATER (flesh) 1John5:6 This is the One who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ— not by water alone, but by water and blood.

[Lapokinanaz]

What if being born of the water is repentance and being born of the spirit is receiving the Holy Spirit

[dougmichalak]

I love Dr. Mike’s work, but he is totally missing the Jewish context of the mikveh in this discussion. It was—and is—said that when a person comes up from the waters of the mikveh, they are ‘like a person born again.’ This is why Jesus was astonished that a Pharisee like Nicodemus wouldn’t get the reference.

I understand how Dr. Mike is trying to connect this with the New Covenant, and the need for salvation beyond ‘Torah keeping’ and Jewish ethnic identity, but he’s missing some of the most important paradigms here. It’s ALL ABOUT Israel. We Gentiles, upon entering the New Covenant, are ADOPTED INTO Israel.

[MrthWave]

Thank you Dr. for this deeper context of Jesus’ conversation with Nicodemus. I’m sure it deeply impacted Nicodemus when on the day of Pentecost Peter told the crowd to repent and be baptized after they asked “What shall we do?” He had just informed them they had killed the Messiah. Their question indicates they “believed” both their sin and their acceptance/confession of Jesus’ identity. Those mass baptisms on that day had a profound effect on the whole city and Judaea. I also find it interesting that every conversion in Acts involves water baptism. Paul says Israel was baptized into Moses at the Red Sea(I Cor. 10), and he also says we are baptized into Christ thus becoming His spiritual seed (Galatians 3:27). How wonderful!

[nikeinjesus]

There is no reason to give water in Jn.3:5 a foreign meaning. It wasn't until Calvin who was the first to give it a foreign meaning and even admitted to it.

Nicodemus had "rejected the counsel of God not being baptized of John" (Lk.7:29).

But for those who submitted to John's baptism, Jesus promised would "go" into the kingdom (Mt.21-31-32).

Keeping in context where born of water is baptism, Jesus continued to explain, "that which is born of the flesh is flesh, " is the baptismal ceremony when our bodies/flesh is baptized, which is visible. Were born of the Spirit is invisible, as the blowing of the wind, the reception of the Spirit, the forgiveness of sins.

Peter does a wonderful job in explaining how one is born of water and Spirit.

"Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever" (1Pt.1:22-23).

Peter is speaking to Christians, those who have obeyed the gospel (Mk.16:16).

First notice our souls are purified when we obey the truth, through the Spirit.

Not when we believe, but when we obey the truth. Being born again by the Word of God.

The Holy Spirit works on our hearts through the Word of God, when we obey the truth, our souls are purified/forgiven.

So, when Jesus was warning Nicodemus, the Holy Spirit was working through his words, the truth.
If Nicodemus heeded Jesus warning and was baptized that night or the following day, he was born again.

"Unless a man is born of water (baptism/obedience) and of the Spirit (through the Word of truth), he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."
(See Acts 11:14).

So many people are confused thinking that born of the Spirit is either Holy Spirit Baptism, or receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Later on Pentecost is when Nicodemus would enter the kingdom and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is a different subject.

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[josephpack]

The spiritual journey is mapped out in the Old Covenant

[therealkillerb]

With all due respect (and I really do mean that), where in either Christian, or Jewish writing is that interpretation ever provided? Where do the rabbis say that the Exodus was the birth of Israel? What ancient (or modern for that matter) Christian scholars write that your interpretation of both the Exodus event, and Jesus word's to Nicodemus, are related in some way? You assert a connection, but as far as I can tell, demonstrate no Biblical or Historical evidence to support it? I am not disagreeing with you, I just want to know how you arrived at that conclusion, because honestly, it seems to come out of thin air.

[dexterbt]

I think this is a stretch.

Rather, Jesus might be pointing Nicodemus to Ezekiel 36, the language there is parallel, where the prophecy says God will sprinkle water to clean, remove heart of stone, and God gives a new heart and a puts a new spirit (Holy Spirit).

[jeremiahshine]

What if the water is TEARS of repentance?

[ktownjunkie]

physical people of Jacob... spiritual people of Israel...

so Ive seen it stated before, and worth some consideration, i think...

[danielboone]

Interesting idea, but I’m not certain about it

[kimjensenable]

I'm liking this discussion. Sounds right somehow. Let's hear more Mike!