The chaos inside OpenAI – Sam Altman, Elon Musk, and existential risk explained | Karen Hao

You know ChatGPT, but how much do you know about the company that made it? Journalist Karen Hao joins us to talk OpenAI’s latest implosion.

Journalist Karen Hao joins Big Think’s Editor-in-Chief, Robert Chapman-Smith, to discuss the recent events at OpenAI, including the ousting and reinstatement of CEO Sam Altman, as well as the ideological clashes regarding the development and release of powerful AI models like ChatGPT.

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Background Context on OpenAI:

Background Context on how AI works:

Background Context on accelerating AI:

Background Context on AI risk:

Books on AI:

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About Karen Hao:
Karen Hao is an award-winning journalist covering artificial intelligence, currently contributing to The Atlantic. Previously, she was a foreign correspondent at The Wall Street Journal focused on AI, China tech & society, and a senior editor at MIT Technology Review, where she wrote about the latest AI research & its social impacts. She was also a fellow with the Harvard Technology and Public Purpose program, the MIT Knight Science Journalism program, and the Pulitzer Center’s AI Accountability network.

[stevetsakiris]

This lady is brilliant! This is the best interview on this issue that I have seen and I have watched practically everything that has been put out after this debacle. Thank you and well done !

[jjsambac]

Gosh I want to strive to be as eloquent and well informed as Karen Hao. Her non-verbal cues are also on point, feels natural
Thank you, this is the best explanation I've gotten.

[OMDMIntl]

Seeing this I love Karen Hao. She is extremely good at describing these events. I hope to hear more from her.

[alexagates]

I’m about halfway through so I may clarify this later but it isn’t lost on me that whether Sam’s commercial ideas/plans are good or bad - the employees had financial incentive to make sure that this company didn’t crash & burn. And I think their very public support of him (and I believe potential Microsoft offers?) is a big part of why he was reinstated. That doesn’t make him or his ideologies “good.” It just makes sure everyone has jobs/money and that is tricky.

[JnAPhotography]

I am curious why she did not mention that Sam Altman was fired from the Y Combinator by the same founder she was talking about who hired him. For lack of transparency and self serving behavior (simplification of course). It's a bit disappointing to see the praise free flowing and the scrutiny and criticism is sparingly used. I expect higher from a foundational journalism hub like Atlantic.

[Yotrek]

TLDR:
1. Employees joined for altruistic reasons.
2. Founder deviated from those reasons.
3. Board fired founder for deviating from altruistic mission.
4. Employees distraught that founder no longer there.
5. Conclusion: Reality distortion field is strong around Sam.

[pbm___]

43:05 - Untrue folktale about facial recognition. Problem is that all camera's have more difficulty focusing on darker/low contrast subjects -- human or not. Period. Its not that they prefer light skinned people -- its that cameras are designed to capture light. They compensate in dark scenes by increasing gain to the image sensors (ISO) but doing this ADDS NOISE to the input. Facial recognition doesn't work well, can't focus, on dark skinned people -- especially in low light -- because lack of contrast+noise in images. Consumer grade cameras don't help. This is a function of (optical) cameras, not baked-in bias.

[stefanlittauer]

Such a pleasure listening to her. Thank you

[ravi.annadurai]

Excellent interview. Learned a lot not only about recent OpenAI tussle, but also generally about AI world. Karen is fantastic in her thought process and articulation.

[seang]

Enjoying this series. Kudos to interviewer for consistently letting the experts speak!

[Isabel-ofwq]

Karen and Robert this was just excellent. The latter sections discussing the broader governance and public discourse needed are really critical as a way forward - we ALL need input. It doesn’t make any sense for the world at large to wait for the “experts” to produce models and products before deciding what we do with them. Every single organization - public and private - and every governing board should be discussing NOW what will and won’t be acceptable guidelines for them in considering when or how to deploy AI. We could start with understanding that it’s all about the data used to train models and who controls it.

[frankvazquez]

Oh THANK GOD! An intelligent woman explaining TECH BRO culture. This is the best interview I've heard about any of this.

[_NAED_]

"I think the biggest lesson is that self-regulation just does not work. This was the most creative and unique solution for self-regulation that has ever been seen, potentially, in Silicon Valley history: the idea of having a non-profit structure that is beholden to no financial anything—and clearly, it spectacularly failed. [...] It is kind of a sham." — Karen Hao

[sava]

This is probably the most brilliant Tech reporter I’ve come across. Her ability to simplify the technology and communicate its impact is just masterful!!!

[DJFresh]

Great points about governance. Companies cannot be trusted to develop important policy that belongs in the hands of governments.

[claudioagmfilho]

🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷👏🏻, That's a valid point, Karen. Local input and involvement are crucial when it comes to AI adoption and regulation. It's not only about federal or international levels but also about how AI affects our everyday lives, whether it's in schools, communities, or workplaces. People like teachers, parents, and community members have valuable insights into the practical impacts of AI, and their voices can shape more tailored and effective regulations. It's important to engage at all levels to ensure responsible and transparent AI integration.

[isabellaabigailow]

Hi, I'm an educator. This was a very helpful and nuanced interview!

[VastSolutionsGroupcom]

I’ve been involved in AI for a long time and could not have done nearly as good of a job in such an interview. Very good!

[alex]

Great interview and interviewee. Karen is fantastic, extremely articulate and knowledgeable on this subject. Great work!

[jamespkinsella]

What a clear powerful interview of the situation. So enjoyable.