A Tongan Mormon Story - Saane Siale Pt. 1 | Ep. 1771

Today John Dehlin is joined by Tongan Mormon, Saane Siale, with special guests Nate Byrd from BYU’s Black Menaces, and Beau Oyler, her former Bishop, as they delve into the unique experiences and challenges faced by racial minorities within Mormonism. They discuss the integration of Mormonism into Tongan culture, the complexities of being part of an ethnic ward, and the impact of white beauty standards on individuals of color. They also explore the internalized racism and the pursuit of academic excellence within marginalized communities, shedding light on the need for advocacy and social justice. Don't miss out on this insightful conversation as Saane shares her journey, from her upbringing to her awakening as an activist, while grappling with her faith and preparing for her future at BYU.

00:00:00 Intro Intentions & Themes
00:05:55 Family background
00:08:15 How the Church ended up with a lot of members of the Church in Tonga
00:21:00 Integration of Mormonism in Tongan culture in California
00:22:30 Is there a beauty in Tongan Mormon culture, but also a loss of traditional culture
00:30:00 Saane’s parents feel that “palangi” (white) wards are better/more organized than polynesian wards
00:43:00 Saane remembers supporting Prop 8 without fully understanding its implications for LGBTQ people and their families
00:57:00 Saane’s activist awakening to issues in diversity and marginalization as Christ-like
01:08:45 How was Seminary, Mutual, dances, etc. Mormon teen life.
01:14:00 Success & righteousness associated with whiteness
01:30:00 Saane acknowledges the costs and benefits of her internalized racism
01:34:00 Parents picking and choosing when to be proud to be Tongan vs idealizing white culture
01:37:30 Women of color just not part of her experience in Mormonism
01:42:30 Saane describes the betrayal of finding out more of the racist history while serving on her mission.
01:45:40 Why Saane’s upbringing would seem successful by Mormon standards
01:56:00 More on how Saane got interested in activism through history in high school
02:24:45 Duality of Anti-blackness among Polynesians along with adoption of much of black culture
02:34:00 Uniqueness of Saane as advocate at such a young age while still faithfully Mormon
02:38:00 How is Saane viewing her future as she is graduating High School and prepping to go to BYU

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[HaapaiTeUrioHau]

So glad Siale has expressed and exposed the blindness of racism and discrimination within our own Polynesian members and towards us by the church system. Goes to show just how much colonization has really hindered our people to be ultimately proud of our heritage, success and skin. This sad mindset is also strong down here in NZ.

[laleli]

Love seeing POC folks on Mormon stories. Please more BIPOC stories 🥹🖤

[sophieamat]

Delighted to hear a Tongan female story! So refreshing. I’m glad that Pacific Islands are being represented on your channel.

[iwantcandy]

She is so insightful and has such strong leadership and communication skills. Excited for part 2!

[Sarah-Graham]

Saane is such a beautiful soul! Thank you for highlighting her story!! My favorite Mormon Story so far!

[nickywal]

This is so fascinating, you rarely hear anything about Tonga at all. I had no idea the Mormon church was so powerful in Polynesia. Also as someone who grew up in a pretty poor area, I agree education is the single most important thing to break cycles of poverty, its why so many cults and high demand religion deny it to their members.

[stacyrect]

non mormon. I cannot express enough how much your posts have helped me with processing both the good, and the horror of organized religion on all sides. The comfort of ritual and the hell of corruption. Thank you, endlessly for honoring both. It is both heartbreaking and inspiring.💕

[bestoffriends]

I resonate with her story so much. I was a brown girl in a white family in a white branch and knew these three things: I would only be happy if I was married 2. The happy Mormon families had a cute white mom with long hair and a clean cut white dad 3. I was a second class member and not worthy of that Such heartbreak for teenage me.

[nnacroon]

So many hard questions! Love her openness to share and educate.

[weeza]

Finally! So happy this demographic is being represented!!!!

[Leinomaaea]

What a great perspective… She is definitely a leader!

[vkestrel]

Nate made some confronting but excellent points toward the end of this discussion. I really appreciate the courage of all the participants in this episode. 🙏🏻

[shellyb]

I so appreciate Saane’s appreciation and fight for blacks. She so eloquently speaks about why it’s important for all minorities for fight for civil rights.. blacks normally lead the fights, but our fights are for all POC.

It’s sad when POC separate themselves bc we’re all viewed the same.

[taylorclay]

Thank you, Saane for sharing your story. I live in a stake with a Tongan ward and I appreciate your perspective and learning more about the Tongan and island cultures

[xochitlkitty]

So happy to hear this one! I’m a never Mo living in Oakland since “92. I live pretty close to the temple and had a Tongan Mormon family as neighbors across the street for a number of years. We had a battle of the signs during prop 8. They put up a vote yes sign, so we put up a poster board that said vote no. The next day they had 19 vote yes signs in their yard. So we got a 4’x8’ piece of plywood and painted a huge vote no sign that you could see from a block away. Nevertheless we were good neighbors to each other. A couple years ago, one of the sons told me he didn’t realize what it was about - like Saane is saying. He apologized. It’s great to hear Saane’s story.

[BG-igfd]

There is a pervasive feeling of LDS being an exclusive club and many people don’t fit into their ideal. Even as a white woman, I experienced some isolation and ostracization within the LDS church. As a convert from age 12, my parents were not members. We also didn’t have much money. As a teen, I didn’t feel truly accepted by my LDS peers. They all came from multi-generational Mormon families. I envied them. Prior to my LDS membership, I had a similar experience with the Brownies/Girl Scouts. At age 8, I went to a school in L.A. that had a majority population of wealthy kids who lived in Beverly Hills, Bel Air and Westwood areas. I joined the Brownies troop with my friends from school. After attending a couple of times, the Brownie leader told my mom that I should join a troop of kids in another area with children of my socioeconomic class and single moms. I cried at the thought of not being able to be with my friends and my mom was insulted by the insinuation that we weren’t good enough for that Brownie troop. The practice of exclusion, is not isolated to Mormonism. It exists wherever there are humans. However, if the church wants to be a moral leader and represent the best of Christ’s teachings, they need to continue efforts toward inclusion. That means actively fighting for gender, race and socioeconomic equality.

[TheHeidishuler]

I’m loving this so much! One of my dearest friends is 1/2 Tahitian. Different islands I know but she had similar experiences.
Also I met Bo at Bill’s event last Tuesday. So happy to know he was such an awesome bishop for her. ❤

[mills]

2:27:39 What John is not understanding is the inherent identity tied to Polynesian culture and customs that is a deep part of our upbringing whether we are brought up among other Polynesians or not. He has even encountered it as he mentioned at the beginning about finding it difficult to get poly guests on. She may have grown up in a white community/ward but she still has a close connection and tie to her poly roots and community.

Next to address: the anti black attitudes in poly communities (which absolutely exists) I think relates to our frequently being mistaken for black or mislabeled by others as black. So two things happen. First, we cling to our identity (which is a very big part of our lives as previously described). Second, we distance ourselves from the black identity/community because we are trying to move up the privilege ladder since we know the historical and current racism faced by black people. We tel ourselves our culture and our people are loved by the white world. It is horrible and needs to be called out. We do this in relation to the church as well. She may not remember being called lamanite because many Polynesians argue we are decedents of lehi that left the Americas to explore the ocean. Total make believe but whatever.

[jamestrek]

This is what we’ve all been waiting for. Cant wait to hear her story

[Britbec]

Such a great interview! Saane is a powerful young person, and I can’t wait to hear more of her impressive journey!