Did London Have Segregation?: The London History Show

Music credits:
Ave Marimba by Kevin McLeod, CC-BY

Sources- 20th-century discrimination:
Bauml Duberman, M. 1989. Paul Robeson.
Bourne, S. 2020. Under Fire: Black Britain in Wartime, 1939-1945. pp. 53-55
Pearson, H. 2017. Connie: The Marvellous Life of Learie Constantine. pp. 295-298
Seton, M. 1958. Paul Robeson.
Sparrow, J. 2017. No Way But This: In Search of Paul Robeson.
Ziegler, P. 1998. London At War, 1939-1945. pp. 217-219

Sources, The Royal Household:

[JDraper]

Lots of interest in the "A Welcome To Britain" film in the comments, so I'll also add: we don't know the name of the guy playing the black GI! If you have any leads, the Imperial War Museum would love to know:

[funeralforahorse]

That PSA for American soldiers is WILD. “You see that? you SEE that??” He’s even doing the dodgy look around to see if anyone can hear him while he’s taking to camera, as if he’s about to make a racist joke. But instead he delivers the unhinged message, “racism here is less cool guys!!”

[theemries]

1.) This video is incredibly fascinating.
2.) I don't know if you should call a hospital or tailor, because you are KILLING that black dress.

[billmische]

Around 1966/67, my mum was looking at flats in Forest Gate. One place she went to look at, on hearing our surname had already gone. 30 seconds later on seeing a blond blue-eyed baby (me) it was mysteriously available again. We didn't take the flat.

[KealohaHarrison]

8:22 fun fact, the white soldier is Burgess Meredith aka Mickey Goldmill from the Rocky movies and The Penguin from the 60s Batman with Adam West

[TheShapeshifter]

I remember seeing a similar WWII video in History. It was two American soldiers, one black, one white, sharing a cigarette, and a voice over going 'yeah this is weird, but it's normal in Britain so get used to it!' (paraphrased, but still)

[lilkiki]

I really appreciate this video. I had recently noticed an alarming amount of comments trying to romanticize England as never having issues with equality under some of your other short vids (not your fault, you always stuck to the facts). It's good to remind people that history, especially about racial/ethnic relations, is complex, intersectional (interconnecting with class, gender, orientation, etc.) and involve more than just black and white populations.

[VelmadeMnaco]

In the west coast of Scotland we had a kind of quasi segregation for decades between catholics and protestants. Even when i was in high school in the early 2000s the spectre still lingered. When my parents got married in the 1970s they had to have a joint wedding service because one was Catholic and the other protestant.

[Ribberflavenous]

This is the reason we need real history taught in the schools. Every country has their embarrassments and injustices, and just like any other mistake, you cannot learn if you do not recognize it, and it is not just racism. East India Company, Caste system, Political prisoners, Censorship, Imperialism, where do you begin? Kids need to understand that people in power will generally serve themselves and their 'kind' unless there are checks and balances to keep them in line with the public benefit. "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" - George Orwell. Excellent video! It is sad we have to learn our history on YouTube, but at least it is available.

[TheJennifer]

really glad to hear someone having an honest conversation about this in a way that is specific to the UK. It is absolutely true that plenty of black Americans visited the UK during the Jim Crow era or before the Civil War and made very favourable comparisons. But it is also absurd to suggest that the UK lacked racism because we didn't have an explicit legal framework like the US. Racism here is *different* from the US in a way that doesn't always easily facilitate a direct comparison. I'd love to hear more discussions like this that focus on the historical realities rather than just importing US discourse unexamined.

I have an American friend who was surprised to notice how many MPs are non-white in the UK, especially when compared with the US legislatures and when you take into account the relative racial makeups of each country. When he asked me about I basically made the point about class that you state at the end. There are also additional dynamics here that don't exist in the US, e.g. the differences between the experiences of black Brits of Caribbean origin (who tended to come to the UK as low-paid labourers) and those of West African origin (who often came to the UK as educated professionals). The history of race in this country is not straightforward and I don't feel like we've even really begun to examine it as a nation.

[cupguin]

There's an interview on YouTube titled "MLK Talks New Phase' Of Civil Rights Struggle, 11 Months Before His Assassination" on NBC News. It's genuinely an interview I think everyone would benefit from watching but in particular MLK is speaking directly about the difference between the overt segregation of the South vs the North.

Things were better and less violent but that didn't make the situation perfect. If anything he argues because it is more nuanced it's a more entrenched and complex fight than what the Civil Rights movement had already achieved. It's harder to see, there's economic barriers not physical ones, it's cultural rather than legal. If you make it a law or a policy then it's a concrete thing that can be addressed. It's a lot harder to explain "here's some statistics that point to an underlying inequality that leads to worse outcomes".

[Peter-ohhc]

Outstanding. The northern USA did not have jim crow laws, but laws about education spending, real estate practices (red-lining), hiring practices, and access fo government programs had a similar effect

[TheWavePixie]

This channel is just so underrated. Transparant use of (primary) sources, great video editing, engaging storytelling and of course phenomenal presentation! This channel is a gem on YouTube and I hope many more people will find it

[markmh]

Once again, an absolutely outstanding video that should be shown in schools. J. Draper is proving herself to be a master storyteller. Thank you for sharing your talents and information with the world.

[OneThreeEight]

Here in Canada there's a lot of history of Black people coming from the US (including many formerly enslaved people who wished for the "formerly" to remain accurate) and thinking that it was wonderful and less discriminatory at first, and then realising later that the discrimination was just less overt. One of the reasons that one of the early Black settlements near me completely disappeared is that after the American civil war, a lot of the settlers decided they would just go back south, because it wasn't enough better here to stay.

[dionnerd]

My mum came here from Grenada in 1959. She told me of an experience that happened to her not long after she arrived. she wanted to buy a coat but was not allowed to try it on or return if it did not fit. She had to ask her white co-worker to return for her! My parents have many more stories of subtle and not so stuble discrimination and segregation. I think in the UK it's obtuse and insidious.

[pamartin]

Heard of your program on Tasting History with Max Miller. So pleased I came for a visit. Your "shorts" are very concise, educational and fun. These indepth videos are put together wonderfully. The editing, the sourcing, visual design, just all of it is great. Keep on! Cheers from the Ozarks.

[ConradW]

Thank you for raising this. The UK has a painfully real problem with class, and even saying that it's breaking a taboo. We have a LOT of work to do with this

[lew-]

Speaking as a person who is both Black and ethnically Jewish I knew right away it was gonna start with "the Jews" and I immediately exclaimed "I fucking knew it!" then bursted with laughter at "I am once again asking people to be normal about the Jews." Because people can never be normal about us lol.

[colinbaker]

That white soldier invited for a cup of tea was Burgess Meredith, who played The Penguin in the 1960s Batman TV series, and Rocky Balboa’s coach.