John Vervaeke on Leaving Christianity | The Tim Ferriss Show

Vervaeke is the director of UToronto’s Consciousness and Wisdom Studies Laboratory and its Cognitive Science program, where he teaches Introduction to Cognitive Science and The Cognitive Science of Consciousness, emphasizing the 4E model, which contends that cognition and consciousness are embodied, embedded, enacted, and extended beyond the brain.

Vervaeke has taught courses on Buddhism and Cognitive Science in the Buddhism, Psychology, and Mental Health program for 15 years. He is the author and presenter of the YouTube series “Awakening from the Meaning Crisis” and his brand new series, “After Socrates.”

Please enjoy!

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[factortest]

I left when I was 17. I stayed out for about 10 years. My personal experience out was not good. When I came back, my faith became much more meaningful to me.

It's sad that the Church hurts so many people. Unfortunately, the Church has a lot of people in it. And people make mistakes and hurt others.

All I know is that my life is better with God than without. And I hope I can be a healing influence not a hurting one.

[DerekJFiedler]

I grew up in a Christian family. Fled to Portland to live the neo-hippie dream. Travelled abroad. Gave the Eastern mystics a try. For some reason God didn't leave, wasn't phased, wasn't offended. His presence annoyed me.

Over time, I invited Christ into my meditation space. Then, one day, I invited him into my heart to give him a trial run as my next guru. What stunned me was what happened next. Christ's presence penetrated to my heart of hearts. He filled me with divine love. He forgave me. His forgiveness healed me. It whipped away a thousand traumas.

Christ was my last guru. He is the center of all things and the real deal. Seek him. Do t give up.

Dr. Vervaeke, I've listened to many hours of your discussions, especially with Jonathan Pageau and PVK. I'm so sorry you experienced what you did. It sucks. People get it wrong. They will disappoint you if you let them. Don't give up on Christ. We are all stumbling along together. All the best to you.

[paulpgoddard]

Still working through the am I good enough crisis of my evangelical upbringing, not to mention the very real PTSD about Hell, and painful cravings for Heaven. I am thoroughly happy to hear a common path from someone I appreciate so much. This alone helps me heal big time. I combine western and eastern spiritualities and secular rationality too in my inner makeup, so I find almost no one to connect with who has all three. So grateful for this.

[sharpsbattle]

There is a wake of destruction left behind by churches. It’s real heartbreaking seeing it play out in people’s lives. I am saved, but left the institution of church 20 years ago.

[jukkaahonen]

I was a Christian, went to the church, read and prayed a lot, studied a Master's degree in theology and I thought this "Word of God" thing was my life. Life felt like worth living, and the church gave a sense of connection. But then I started asking questions, and came to the conclusion that I didn't want, that Christianity is not true. I fell into the depths of nihilism, but with stubborn belief in the value of life I have kept on searching for things that I care about that could give a sense of purpose. I still feel quite indifferent and empty, but I have noticed that perseverance helps in one's search for meaning. Life has become gradually better.

[Gruso]

I just never thought of a higher being as plausible when I was at my lowest. Being told "just believe in god" while hurting and young wasnt an answer for me so I sought out psychology and the research to help myself. You know, tangible things....

[GabrielsGalaxy]

Haven’t started the video yet — but I read through some of the comments about this video being about Christianity’s culture being too hard or guilt-Inducing, etc… it’s funny because I just watched a message today about how the speaker’s old Christian church left him feeling guilty and scared, and that’s what eventually made him leave that church — only to find that TRUE Christianity is not the hardcore strict religion (that Jesus Himself warned about), but that it’s a loving relationship with Christ. It’s about loving God and loving our neighbors, and not about fear mongering or judging or hating on anybody

[rebeccajoseph]

I think the treasure chest of Catholicism answers many of the longings mentioned by John and many commenters. It has liturgy that embodies worship in physical, spiritual, and mental ways, individually and communally. It has a rich philosophical and spiritual intellectual tradition, music, prayer, and a wide range of spiritual practices. I would recommend it.

[gybx]

You don't need to leave Christianity. The major issue is Biblical literalism. I was raised C-fundamentalism, too. But I discovered the Christian mystics as well as Buddhism. Jewish wisdom is also helpful. Doctrinalism is the bane of Christianity, imho.

[shetaz]

Great video. I can relate to John. I was raised the same way...terrified I had committed the unforgiveable sin as a child. Traumatic upbringing.

[toriarose]

I left about the same age... This is what we're doing to our children, traumatizing them, instilling so much fear in them, our people. It's THE reason our world looks like "hell." I was still fearing things like the number 666 in my 30's. People believe insane, infantile things; it all keeps them as children (trauma does that). It makes our people so much easier to enslave, to line up for any gd thing. They make is all so complicated by design. The space for wisdom is within us. We simply need to discover, to know, that we ARE spiritual. We are consciousness. That we are INHERENTLY (no conditions) valuable/powerful (same thing). There are good messages (mostly symbolic) in the old book, but they've been twisted into lies. Moses said, "I am nothing without god." Now if we were actually nothing without something, uh, then we would literally be valueless (nothing without something is still NOTHING; hence, a world of self-loathing ones always needing SOMETHING to make them feel valuable/powerful). If we are "nothing without god, " it's because we ARE 'god, ' the rightful "lord" of our own lives. That's all you really need to know. "Be still and KNOW"(=WISDOM) ... "Be still and KNOW that I AM god." Yes you are.

[OnlineMD]

Such a strange triad: Vipassana (from Sanskrit Vipashyana which means to see with great insight), Metta (from Sanskrit Mithra or friendship) which is often referred to as loving kindness but I believe the literal translation is just exuding or radiating friendliness. And Tai Chi. Hey, nothing wrong with that if it works for you! I'm a Chi Gong guy myself. And oh, I forgot to write above, Vipassana is often wrongly pronounced Vipaasana. That's actually not accurate. It is Vi-pus-sana. The pus rhymes with fuss. In Sanskrit, Pashya (pronounced Pushya rhyming with plush) is to see, observe. It is the origin of the practice of MINDFULNESS.

[danerose]

Sensitive, traumatized HSP's who believe the bible literally are going to go through this kind of hell. I have gone through it. It makes it very hard to find the divine when the greatest traumas in life are associated with one's religion and the word "divine." The sociopathic cruelty towards John in some of the comments by people who claim to be close to Christ is just one more deterrent, since who wants to be associated with sociopaths who are too insane to understand their cruelty, and think they are Christians?

[goodstuff]

I never understood conflating personal experiences with the search for Truth. Truth is universal, personal experiences are not, especially when not fully understood as an emotional child.

[Scribbzz]

"Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and mind." The church, the people, what they say, what they may think CAN be relevant and important, yet always is secondary. Christ always comes FIRST. If we put our trust into people, fallible and sinful, we WILL get hurt. This is why we put our faith in God. Listen to his word. Learn with him. Become closer.

[tylercrawley]

Very Relatable. It is definitely psychological torture and control

[cheerwhiner]

0:24 I’m very sorry for you… as I have gotten older, and the world grows more absurd and backwards, that the truth of Christ is all that can stand the tests of time and life.
He is the only peace is this ridiculous world of up being down, and down being up.
I feel bad for you.

[margaretschwartzentruber]

He didn't really leave "Being" a Christian, at age 15. He simply moved into other "Other Ideas" ... he blames his background for trauma. Sorry, Man's Search For Meaning by Voctor Frankl doesn't need a rewrite.

[debj]

"religion" should be against the law, it's a "sin" all the trauma they cause.

[badreddine.elfejer]

Or entering non-theistic transcendental naturalism