Christian accidentally affirms morality based on God is subjective

I wish I will get a dollar for every time the word "nature" is going to be used by Christians in the comments (if they do comment).

⚠️ You’re free to use this song in any of your YouTube videos, but you MUST include the following in your video description (Copy & Paste):

––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Creative Commons — Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported— CC BY-SA 3.0
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––

🎵 Track Info:

Title: Say Good Night by Joakim Karud
Genre and Mood: Hip Hop & Rap + Happy

———

🎧 Available on:

———

😊 Contact the Artist:

———

✅ About using the music:

- You MUST include the full credits in your video description.
- You can NOT claim the music as your own.
- You can NOT sell the music anywhere.
- You can NOT use the music as background music for your own musical work without the artist's consent.
- You can NOT use the music without giving any credits in the video description.
- You can NOT remove or add parts from/to the credits.
- You can NOT use third-party software to download the video/track, always use our download links
- You MUST contact the artist if you wish to use the music on any kind of project outside of YouTube.

⚠️ Important:

- If you don't follow these policies, you can get a copyright claim/strike.
- If you need more information about using music, please get in touch with the artist.
- This channel is not an official YouTube channel.

———

We have created a new channel where we do an agreement with the artist and our record label to make sure all the music is free and 100% safe.

———

🔀 More free music:

———

❤️ Get in touch with Audio Library:

———

———

———

Read our disclaimer before using the music.

[magnabosco]

You don’t understand, Doug. Morality is objective because all Three of the Holy Trinity agree. 😂

[fotheon-]

I will never get tired of the Euthyphro Dilemma. Nice one Doug

[reverendgordontubbs]

My moral opinions are relative to God's subjective moral opinions.

[DBCisco]

How do Christians walk after shooting themselves in the foot so much ?

[TJump]

you should add the meme minecraft glasses to your profile pic

[tonydarcy]

Where does my moral outlook come from ? Certainly not from any God as I've always been an atheist. From my parents, from my schooling, from my society, all godless, and so far zero murders, rapes, assaults, robberies etc to my name. Unlike the God of the Bible who seems determined to wipe out all those who don't worship him.

[quantumrobin]

How sad it’s considered an “accident” when a Christian recognizes how cultural morality changes and is subjectively working to get better with time, welcome to reality, this is what we’ve been saying.

[Jeremiahsamraj]

I see a misunderstanding of the definition of objectivism here. I think a more sound philosophical definiton would actually exclude even the situations besides our own reasoning as a determiner of truth. Subjectivism leaves truth to be ascertained of our cognitive ability. The point is, since human opinions/systems are always subject to change (Ex. even our definition of objectivism! Ouch!), we lack proper basis to arrive at moral laws (as found in general physical laws). As Christians we believe that the laws of nature, laws of logic etc. are transcendent and objective (not subject to change due to opinions or situations) because of their source - God. We believe God is transcendent and so are his laws - logic, gravity, morality etc. which are all a reflection of His unchanging character. Hope this offers clarifty to ppl on both sides.

[DennisPulido]

Is it moral to lie to protect your family even if the protection of your family through said lie results in the destruction of another family?

[BiDrd]

I just realized a mistake I made a year ago in one of my points that another gentleman helped me recognize.

I think there should be unpacking with red pin logic's point where we don't take for granted that we understand where what he's referring to as we try to flip the argument backwards against him. I'll try throughout this whole post to unpack some things that are not being mentioned which I think are relevant to understand. When "Red Pill Logic" says "it depends on the situation", I believe he's referring to principles that are objective which are being applied in different situations, and those principles come from God, and to the degree of person utilizes or conforms to those principles is the degree in which a person's action is a moral fact, and I'll try to unpack something later on to explain why it would still be objective even though it comes from God. If what I'm saying is true, then this video is misinterpreting Red Pen Logic's point.

With God, good and evil are not just concepts like the way you and I may think of good and evil but have actual existing properties that are the direct essence of good or evil. Good or evil are not just the actions themselves, it's a spiritual nature which manifests itself in the actions we do.

Revelation 5:8 — And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, *and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.*

What this makes mention of is something we consider an abstract, like words or thoughts, and according to a natural perspective these are only abstracts, but according to the supernatural, they have spiritual properties to them in which thoughts or words can have *a smell, aroma, or odor.*

Luke 11:34-34
34The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness.
*35Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.*

This scripture is saying that our desires emits an actual aura around us that can be literally light or dark, implying that there are actual properties that are produced from our desires that are objectively good or evil.

Numbers 5:3 — Both male and female shall ye put out, without the camp shall ye put them; that they defile not their camps, in the midst whereof I dwell.

This scripture is saying that God does not dwell with things that are not holy, implying holiness is not just a concept, it has an actual existing property as well as things that are defiled.

Deuteronomy 7:25-
25The graven images of their gods shall ye burn with fire: thou shalt not desire the silver or gold that is on them, nor take it unto thee, lest thou be snared therein: for it is an abomination to the LORD thy God.
*26Neither shalt thou bring an abomination into thine house, lest thou be a cursed thing like it: but thou shalt utterly detest it, and thou shalt utterly abhor it; for it is a cursed thing.*

This scripture is saying that even curses have properties to them and can spread an infect other things around it and cause those things to also be cursed, including inanimate objects.

Goodness, evil, blessings, cursings, holiness, things that are defiled, prayers and thoughts all have supernatural properties to them. From our perspective, they're just concepts or abstracts, but supernaturally speaking, these things have literal existing properties, and our being emits this nature based on the internal conditioning of our thoughts and desires.

This means goodness would exist as an objective principle, and to the extent we conform to the nature of God which is good, that is the degree in which our action is a moral fact. Because goodness is expressed by nature in principal, then it would be applied differently in different situations, but because the principle is objective, the action is objectively good or evil, even if it changes for a given situation. However, the source of which this goodness comes from is God, and therefore even though it changes from situation to situation, God is still the source of it.

This video seems to be misinterpreting it and saying that "It changes from the situation, but doesn't come from God", or "God inventing his own morality is subjective", but I don't think it's that simple, because there's a supernatural element that seems to apply which is highly relevant which this video doesn't seem to be acknowledging.

That's why I'm inclined to believe that this video is a strawman.

[JerryPenna]

The way I understand it, subjective means mind dependent and objective means mind independent. I’ve not heard one person say that subjective means they can’t be wrong. Context matters - always. Can’t see how to make any judgment without the context. That’s why I identify my epistemology as contextualist.

[aprilhollingsworth]

It’s amazing at how often we find gymnastics within Christianity.

[greyback]

You should do some short video with Capturing Christianity explaining why we should thank the person who throw a grenade coz then a soldier can express courage by throwing himself on it to save others

[kennylee]

Objectivism means that there is a truth external to oneself - a truth that simply is, regardless of whether one agrees or not.

Subjectivism means that there is no external truth - truth depends on whether one agrees or not.

The biggest flaw with this reasoning is that God is reduced to the same ontological status as humans. By definition, God is transcendent - beyond humanity. That’s what makes him objective. It’s a standard that goes beyond mere whims. What this video tries to do is discredit Mr. B’s argument for objective morality by claiming that the objective standard himself is subjective. Yet the logic is circular - to discredit objective truth, it’s claimed that *truth itself* is subjective. God is not merely a human person on a higher plane of existence.

When the argument is made that God himself is subjective, it very egregiously mischaracterizes God. It’s a straw man. God isn’t arbitrarily making up standards - he *is* the standard. God doesn’t arbitrarily make moral decisions - he *is* morality.

The argument made by Christians is that there must be an objective truth to ground any moral worldview because subjectivism is contradictory in application - no moral claims can be made and no moral obligations exist. That objective truth must be beyond humans by definition: ie, transcendent in nature. This video does not disprove any of that. It only attempts to show a contradiction in objective morality, and that contradiction stems from equating God with a human.

Now, Mr. B’s definitions could be more accurate. I believe he gets it mixed up with absolute and relative morality, where something is true regardless of the circumstance. Now that is a dangerous claim to make.

[waynemills]

Objective morality is just another term like 'specified' complexity. It's a cloak to smuggle an objective giver into the conversation, which ironically, equates to man's objective moral law is god's subjective stamp.
Morality is simply shared intentionality to promote mutual benefit and yet theists tend to attribute all good things within the human condition to gods and the bad to demons (or themselves). A perverse and projected commentary on the cognitive byproducts of disgust and shame.

[franklindzioba]

Something to think about..very well done video.

[CedanyTheAlaskan]

I'm confused by what he is trying to say
As a Christian, if a killer asks me where my family is, I wouldn't tell them. Whether that means to lie or just not answer. I see nothing wrong with having to lie for some things. Lying is still bad but there are times when it almost certainly necessary. And since lying is a sin, it's a good thing Jesus came to forgive us for our sins

[PhantomRangerEarth]

Oh pinecreek, I've never wanted to hug another man more! Bless you for this.

[joeltoews]

If morality is subjective, than why have any laws? For example: Why put someone in prison for murdering someone, if that person thinks that murdering someone isn't wrong?
We have laws against murder, because murder in itself is wrong (without an actual valid reason for doing it).

[Marques]

But did he answered the dilemma? Because to under divine command is impossible to know