Have DJI and ZF killed the mid-power e-bike? Game-changing tech launched | The MBR Show

The big news this month is the arrival of drone giant DJI, and automotive behemoth ZF, into the e-bike market. DJI was the biggest surprise for most people, with not only a motor that (on paper) wipes the floor with most of the competition, but a whole new bike to mount it on. Yes, Amflow is effectively a DJI start-up brand solely created to bring this high-end motor to life. We discuss the potential of this system, ponder some of the possible weaknesses, and try to answer whether it's worth all the hype.

ZF is a huge automotive brand supplying gearboxes, electronics and even complete electric drivetrains. And it has entered the e-bike market with an impressive looking motor, boasting lightweight, compact dimensions, and plenty of power. Will it be enough to put the frighteners on some more established motor brands? And will we see it appear on e-bikes from mainstream brands soon?

We also speculate about what's new with Bosch's unreleased Gen 5 CX motor, spotted on numerous bikes at the recent Eurobike show.

We also take a look at the latest Specialized Stumpjumper 15. Alan has been to the launch of this significant new bike and dug deep into the details with the product manager and suspension engineer. We find out about the new Genie shock, and why it's such a clever bit of kit, as well as discover Alan's first ride impressions. For Alan's full first ride review, packed with insight, click the link below.

Finally, we find out more about YT's latest e-bike, the Decoy SN. Danny went to the launch for this, and goes through all the details, as well as revealing his pick of the new range, and why. To read more about his first ride impressions, click the link below.

Time stamps:

0:30 DJI motor/Amflow bike
5:50 ZF motor
9:09 Secret new Bosch motor
12:36 Specialized Stumpjumper 15
17:11 YT Decoy SN

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[mattving]

Here's a wild idea. UMM... Universal Motor Mount? I suppose that would reduce manufacturers bottom line a little too much though.

[Photoshopuzr]

You are the people we need speaking for real buyers that pay with their own money 12:14 "not the freeloaders that get bikes for free all the time" I appreciate you said that. Im a long-time rider that build my own analog bikes over the years. it's gotten crazy in this day and age where there are no options like to upgrade motors or batteries as they become better and better. Such a shame.

[jpravetz]

The headline should be the ZF's lifetime warranty (this is true, correct?). I'm tired of replacing expensive Brose motors every two years. DJI looks sexy, but more tech could mean more things to fail. We should talk more about reliability and service, else the vendors will continue to ignore these issues.

[axiomic]

Oooh I wonder if the DJI will have a "Return to Home" option 😝

[johnminichielli]

Wow, 120 NM torque ! I've had an FLX with a Bafang M600 small, lightweight motor with 120 NM of torque for 6 years. I now have 20, 000 miles on it without skipping a beat, and I've done 13 mile 8- 20 % grade climbs without ever overheating the motor.

[Twentykixx]

I’m on the wait yet. If a full power eMTB can manage @+630wh and @+85nm with a weight under @20kilo with reasonable tires, enduro casing etc., it’ll push the dial to purchase. Nothing is close to this yet, so I’m keeping my rig for now. No need to jump on the bandwagons for every acute and sometimes minuscule or limited technologies coming into the market. I’ll run 170/170 and do everything with it using adjustable suspension. 👍🏼

[tomcagle]

Most that don't race won't need 110 Nm for the DJI and big overrun for tech climbing. It's their wireless set the absolute gold standard. The big news is ZF-90. It's compact size at 90Nm is the perfect platform for a compact 8-spd gearbox....this the future! And they already make gearboxes...that's the real gamechanger: the 20.5 kg lighter weight, full-power gearbox.🫨 The true unicorn!🦄

[danielduesentriebjunior]

Anyhow, the most impressive product I have seen recently is MGU Pinion.

[MarvinShoes]

I have two road hikes with rim brakes. My workout bike is an emtb. It weighs 24.5kg and I only use the motor in high headwind situations. There are no hills on my ride. I consider drop bars to be only for people without back pain and those who usually drive cars who have to get where they are going as fast as possible whilst appreciating as little as they can of the countryside they are travelling through. The upright riding position in a head-wind is better offset by help from an electric motor than tucking your head up your ar$e and spinning like a crazy person.

[FrankyDesign]

I hope DJI will make MGU (Motor Gearbox Unit) in the future.

[PhilosoFox]

ZF Motor provides a great user experience: compact for better bike designs, noise level of electric sirr sounding like honest power up, well adjustable acceleration and support that doesn't let you hit a wall at cut-off point but provides what you wish for, weight close to a light weight system. As of now, ZF omitted a gearbox for higher volume sales at deeper price points, but that's exactly what I wish for: a superior Pinion version in the years to come. They might have opted for aged battery tech, but till then will surely up their ante as well. I'm definitely curious how efficient the motor is as of now and where it will be in two years!

[markwaughman]

Thinking of going to the darkside ( ebike ) . But torn so much choice. Was liking the orbea wild, mondraker dune . Then yt brought out the new decoy which is a lot of bike for the money . Now the amflow has been announced, which looks great. No doubt there will be more to . Its a nightmare.

[corran-soul]

Put a 1/3 size battery in the bike. Really small and light, and I’ll have 1 or 2 more in the car and switch them out between laps, and charge it in the car while riding. It’s the battery that’s heavy…

[ebikescrapper]

Will it have much impact in the BBS02 and BBSHD? I don't think so, unless one of the big brands use a his then it won't affect Bosch etc.

[yurioira]

another wild idea, DJI can start thinking replacing current motor systems out there (wiring, & batt included) & mounts in the market like YAMAHAs and SHIMANOs :-0 instead of going into full mode of creating frames for their motor. :-0

[The.JZA.]

Even if the new motors are a bit more powerful, the existing motors are already fantastic so it’s not like it’s revolutionary, just an evolution. The Bosch Gen 4 has been out for years now so expect to see a Bosch Gen 5 that will most likely compete with these new motors some time soon. Also I’ve been e-biking for about 3.5 years and I miss the workout and strength building of acoustic bikes so I have ordered a Stumpjumper 15 Expert and I’ll keep my e-bike as well.

[Zetler]

Unless they can get these motors on 5K bikes they won’t make a dent. The much hyped Pinion motor is stuck on a 10K bike and it’s so rare that it might as well not exist.

[dannygarcia]

Love these two. Such a great duo. Bought my first hardtail based on their reviews

[ericb.]

Very interesting power advances. These advances can ALSO be utilized in HUB MOTORS. (BLASPHEMY!)
Seriously, hub motors are NECESSARY for cargo bikes and especially EMTB cargo bikes like my E-CELLS Super Monarch Crown and Kings Crown. Hub motors don't put strain on the chain. With my bike's 400 pound limit saving the chain is crucial.

[GVPARTS]

Where is it? What does it look like. Have you tested it? Show us what you are talking about.