Race and IQ — Sam Harris and Charles Murray Set the Record Straight on Intelligence Testing

This is an excerpt from episode 73 of Waking Up with Sam Harris, published on the 22nd of April 2017, titled Forbidden Knowledge, in which Sam Harris talks to Charles Murray about racial, cultural, and gender specific IQ differences..

[LiViro]

As a white European man, I have no problem with science showing Eastern Asians on average being smarter than "my" group. And Ashkanasi Jews being smarter than Eastern Asians, on average.

[MrNiggle]

It blows my mind how weak minded people are about race and IQ. Why do you need to believe that every single group of people are exactly equal, when it's so demonstrably false?

[unkorichie]

Every time I watch the news, I see the Bell Curve in full effect.

[thomasowen]

"we're doing enormous harm to young people by making it harder to treat them as individuals"
You hit the nail on the head there buddy. I don't want to be tokenized or mistreated based on my group identity. I don't want to be judged, accepted or rejected based on group identity. I certainly don't want to make a habit of judging others based on any superficial category they might fit into

[schecter]

Still trying to figure out why people on my campus called him a white supremacist. Seems like at worst he is just a contraversial social scientists who is asking taboo questions.

[asdfasdfasdf]

they dont like to touch on this subject because it explains a lot of difference in outcome

[carlosenriqueulloa]

No one has a problem saying blacks are genetically stronger and faster. It's positive, and It's also true. All truth should be embraced and accepted, even if it's negative, as long as it's true.

[sameasnow]

things to keep in mind that can't be stated clearly enough:
1) average performance implies nothing about an individual
2) an individual's performance implies nothing about the average
3) small differences in average performance can have a large effect on overall performance/competitive performance (the smaller the winner's pool, the more it is representative of the group with a higher average performance)
4) average and overall performance can affect the individual at the social and psychological level in a positive or negative way.

[keyrtan]

Things that affect IQ;
Genetics (pic smart spouses ladies)
Environment (nutrition is nowhere near where it needs to be omg)
Training (meditators and musicians regularly score higher than those who don't do those things)

[rekthur]

The 100m dash doesn't indicate how fast you are. It only indicates how good you are at running the 100m dash.

[jbhrs]

We need to be honest about race and stop fearing the discussion

[beverlyhurd]

How come no *B* people ever were intelligent enough to win a Nobel Prize for physics, chemistry, physiology or medicine? Since 1901 there have been over *600* Nobel prizes given out and not one of them ever won one for the above categories. Think about that.

[HieronymousLex]

Most of the bell curve was actually not about race, just that one chapter was. I think even Charles forgot that at the end

[redmen]

We see genetic differences in practically every physiological trait of human beings. I'd be profoundly surprised if there were no intellectual differences across ethnic/racial groups

[petmensan]

North and South Korea have been separated for 70 years, North Korea is starving and has the same average iq, where is the environmental difference?

[oooo]

When I sometimes went out socializing with people in Mensa, at a bar or something, and other people asked how we knew each other and we told them what our group was, we would always kind of defend ourselves almost automatically by immediately adding that it just meant that we were good at taking tests. I believe it was a group disingenuousness, and we never talked about how we always did that.

[esquire]

Thomas Sowell said something similar... he did fine at Harvard, and he knew a lot of black guys that dropped out. He said, would they have been better off graduating from an above average school? Or dropping out of Harvard and not getting a degree.

[MENDLER]

Discrimination (affirmative action) is not a way to fight discrimination

[jameseldridge]

Real life is the biggest indicator for truth. I live outside of a major city, and you can see the disparity whenever you go downtown. I took the metro to a baseball game, all you see at the station are my people (blacks) either panhandling, playing music/dancing, or standing around smoking. On the commute it's all uppity whites internally fearful but having to subconsciously pretend it's due to the poverty or slavery. On the train we'll be the loudest and most disruptive, but whites have to keep quiet because they fear being called racist. We arrive at the stadium (in the most gentrified area) and its all blacks bargaining waters, hats, tickets, and whites give them money either out of guilt or shame. In the stadium its whites in the press boxes and office rooms while blacks do the most simple jobs like punch your ticket or pass out beers. Its just fascinating to me how unnatural the interactions are. More so how much we go thru life lying to ourselves about reality and why things are the way they are. I feel 2nd hand embarrassment when I'm in the city because they look at me and instantly play the white guilt complex or expect me to internally hate them, or act like the rest. Its like we've been fed lies about reality to shield our emotions, and if you don't believe the lie then you're evil, heartless, etc. I think the phrase is moralistic fallacy, but public opinion is definitely the most powerful thing in a democratic, heterogeneous society.

[向你祖母問好]

People angry at the book probably have not even attempted to read the book. Usually people that can't read 1 page without checking facebook.