atheism as congruence [cc]

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subtitles
Bulgarian: Djeitko
Slovak: Peter Ščigulinský
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This is one of two videos — an atheist diptych, if you will — giving an account of my journey into atheism. While this one looks at the cognitive side, the accompanying video — 'transition to atheism' — deals with the emotional side of my transition.

Chinese cc available — translation by yellowlynx

[Airedar]

A healthy scepticism of science -is- science.

[TheraminTrees]

'what do you think about skepticism in general?'
—I think it's not only the most intellectually honest position, but also the healthiest position in pragmatic terms. Scepticism shoehorns a 'gap' of thought between stimulus and response, so that we don't react in pat, non-thinking reflexes — we stop to consider; we act with more awareness and spontaneity.

[ajwspjs]

Thank you for these two videos. I thought I was Christian, and firm in my beliefs, saved. And then the Jehovah Witnesses started showing up. And no matter how much I politely refused, they ignored me and kept coming back. I began to feel like my driveway belonged to Kingdom Hall they showed up so often. I asked to be put on a do not call list. That didn’t work. My pleasant refusals turned into barely respectful refusals which turned into righteousness, my beliefs better and kinder than theirs. But still they persisted. Weekly, several times a week...they beat a path to my door. So I turned to the internet to figure out how to get rid of them. Most of those suggestions didn’t work. Then I started watching the documentaries, saw all the denial, the rampant sexual abuse, the fact that...in order to practice their religion, they had to constantly involve non-JWs in order to remain in good standing. I was outraged that they used me merely to fill in their own scorecards, and that they were just so misguided and wrong. If they would just be regular mainstream Christians they would be far better off. And then I realized I was beginning to dehumanize them the way they were doing to me. And suddenly...the Emperor had no clothes. I have a lot of work to do, and no, it’s not comfortable, but there is no way to UNSEE the naked Emperor. So thank you for your videos.

[bijntjeveenstra]

I was already an atheist when i found your channel but your videos did stretghen my thought and opions with proper evidence and explinations

[PhoenixF]

5:07 Not to mention the fact that, if a christian is mortally sick and recovers, all this does is increase the chance that they'll eventually lose their faith and end up in hell. One of the things that kept my faith going so long was the stories my father, a pastor, would tell me about the supposedly miraculous healings he had prayed for and observed. But several of those people, I learned as I grew older, later became arrogant or complacent and rejected their faith, believing that they had recovered on their own. (Which is true, as it happens.) My point is, why snatch people back to this terrible planet, where their faith is in danger and where they experience suffering, if we believe that upon death they will be transported to a mystical paradise where their salvation is never in danger again and they experience nothing but bliss? Praying for a fellow christian to survive a life threatening experience is actually, from a logical standpoint, a selfish and borderline sadistic action. Much better to let them die instead.

[TheraminTrees]

'where does it say in any actual religion " if they dont believe in me they should be cast away or hated"??? no where'
— Where are you getting this from? "Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?" is one of MANY bible quotes used to cast out unbelievers.

[TheraminTrees]

On behalf of me and Qualia, thank you. I'm glad you enjoyed the death videos. It was heartening and moving to see people engaging with that tender subject so readily and openly. Salutations from across the pond! Theramin.

[sambutler]

"..everything feels so pointless.."

This kind of thing makes me rather indignant. Bullies like C.S. Lewis assert over and over again that the fundamental 'reason' for life is to participate in a relationship with Christ/God. The reaction to this, to someone who's been indoctrinated, is that if there is no divine being to relate with, there is no purpose to life. What a terrible lie to tell to children, regardless of how well-intentioned the proponents of this lie are.

[timrichardson]

I've read many replies to this video that go something like, "Nothing is objective. Everyone has their own reality (beliefs) they live by." This type of statement is used to make religious claims and atheistic claims equal. But the truth is, while there is a degree of subjectivity to every experience, they are not all subjective. They're not even mostly subjective all of the time. There are experiences that we can share with people in which each person can independently validate what occurred. If 5 people witnessed an event, and they all told the same story without any communication between them, then certainly the experience was not completely subjective. This video is making the point that beliefs should be based in verifiable evidence. True, we all have biases and subjective opinions given us by our upbringing, which Theramine admits in the video. Like he said, it's disingenuous to say that all statements/facts/beliefs are equally subjective, because they are not. The whole point of science is to distinguish between what is perceived to be true, and what is actually true.

[TheraminTrees]

Well, that's misquoted, and it's disputed whether Rossetti said anything to that effect, though it's attributed to him. But in any case, the sentiment is nonsense. As an atheist myself, I have an appreciation for my good fortunes without feeling any need to thank any false entity or personification.

[TheraminTrees]

Thanks. The internet wasn't around when I was breaking out of my childhood indoctrination, so it's great to have that tool now and for us all to be able to share our thoughts on these issues.

[hegel]

I've always noticed that there was something just slightly different between the various research scientists who have taught my college classes and the very dogmatically religious (or just anti-science) people I've met, but I've never been able to put my finger on it until now.

I guess that the difference is that scientists accept that they do not know something currently and that they need to do more work.

[TheraminTrees]

The image that comes to mind with this transition is waking out of a coma — the exhaustion of using unused muscles. I think there are often 3 stages of reaction: a) wanting to sink back into the coma [attached to the past]; b) remain on the bed [detached from the past]; c) inspiration, perhaps from goals, to build up and move on [embracing the future]. I think we move through these stages at our own pace. Hopefully, knowing we're not alone can help. I wish you well. ;8)

[cat-star]

Unquestionably, your videos present the best, most unemotional, most well-thought-out discussions on atheism.

[TheraminTrees]

'The atheist Delusion! .... If we follow the chain of causality back, we will ultimately reach the primary cause. Let us say that cause is not God, but matter. Tell us who created primary matter.'
—Do you see how the question 'who created primary matter' already presupposes that someone created it? The default isn't that someone made it, unless proved otherwise. The intellectually honest default is 'We don't know, until we have evidence of what happened'. Is there a problem with 'We don't know'?

[JoshwithaJ]

This is great. I get so caught up in the physical sciences (damn you, Thunderf00t!) that I often neglect looking at the psychological aspects of religious belief. Great video! Thank you!

[jazztutorial]

such good points in this. Maybe one day you could do a 'best of TheraminTrees' video, with all your strongest points back to back.

[Evidnc]

Absolutely lucid and wonderful. I'm sure it will be over many believers' heads but I'm sure it does much to educate and inspire the atheist community that has to deal with them, which is always a good thing.

[oingie]

while watching this, I had a candle lit in my room. and out of nowhere it started flickering and burning brighter. my immediate thought was: it must be a sign from God or a ghost. I've been an atheist for about 3 years now, and it sucks that religion is still burned into my brain

[TheraminTrees]

Thanks gavtronics — I'm glad the concepts came through to people. I did a lecture on this a couple of years ago and the audience struggled. I was quite shocked, because the congruence concept had really facilitated my thinking on a lot of social phenomena. But I thought I'd try again here — and most people seem to have had no trouble with it!