What If The 14 Points Actually Succeeded? | Alternate History

Woodrow Wilson's Fourteen Points are often oversimplified and misunderstood. Fewer are even aware that the 14 Points didn't actually come to fruition, but saw significant deviations by the Triple Entente powers of France and Britain who wanted to acquire more geopolitical assets for themselves in the form of new colonies, allies, and resources, while punishing Germany and the Central Powers all the more. Wilson didn't want a new balance of power, Wilson wanted a sustaining peace that would keep America out of future wars now that it was a Great Power, and bound to be drawn into conflicts involving the likes of France, Britain, and Germany. In today's alternate history scenario we ask "what if the fourteen points actually succeeded" and go point by point, explaining what Wilson's plan actually meant, and how it would have impacted Europe and the world if it was successfully implemented following the Great War. Would World War Two still happen? Would Germany remain bitter? Would the Soviets still rise up?

0:00 Intro
2:41 What If The 14 Points Actually Succeeded?
2:54 Point 1 Explained
3:31 Point 2 Explained
4:11 Point 3 Explained
5:05 Point 4 Explained
5:45 Point 5 Explained
8:08 Point 6 Explained
10:17 Point 7 Explained
10:46 Point 8 Explained
11:09 Point 9 Explained
12:11 Point 10 Explained
12:49 Point 11 Explained
14:04 Point 12 Explained
17:02 Point 13 Explained
17:44 Point 14 Explained
20:57 Outro & Spinning Wilson
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[MonsieurDean]

Howdy folks. Like I've said before, I'm aiming for 200k Subscribers, so if you haven't already, hit the subscribe button.

[oliverstianhugaas]

He truly was the first certified hoi4 peace deal AI.

[algernonilfracombe]

Mr Z, this is one of your most in-depth and thorough videos yet, almost like citing a historical analysis from another world. I've been watching your videos since early in 2020 and while even the early ones were intelligent and entertaining, there's really been an enormous improvement in this time. These and the contemporary analysis videos are some of your most impressive. Fantastic work and please keep it up!

[SneedPatch]

11:41 If we're basing the borders of post-WWI Italy on nationality and ceding Corsica and Malta to them on this (debatable) basis, logic would dictate that South Tyrol would remain Austrian due to its German-speaking majority. Fiume and a larger portion of the Dalmatian coast being ceded to Italy would make sense though

[achaeanmapping]

Noooo! Are you telling me Wilson actually had good intentions and wasn't the mortal manifestation of Satan ?!?!?!?

[agsalesalex]

Things like this just keep reminding me that we live in one of the worst timelines.

[themightyeagle]

Wait, a map of Europe (and technically the Middle East) that uses more ethnic lines than lines of concurring? Impossible!

[suarezguy]

Even without the actual Treaty of Versailles (which was also not really implemented, enforced), especially if there were still any sizable reparations, the Great Depression would have probably still caused a lot of nationalist resentments and ambitions particularly in Germany, it's also hard to see the US and Europe, let alone right-wing countries in Europe, just remaining tolerant of Communist and ambitious (even if currently inwardly-focused) Russia.

[Cool-]

Honestly this, along with personal reading, has really lightened my opinion on Wilson, he may not have been the greatest, however he had some good points.

[jamesr]

As much as I believe following the 14 points may have prevented WWII, it's difficult for me to say that would have been a great scenario since WWII directly led to my existence since my grandparents only met because my grandfather was drafted into the Army and was stationed in Texas where he met my grandmother. These are certainly interested scenarios and hindsight shows most of us that these ideas should have been a no-brainer to implement in order to prevent a second war.

[sulaymanbah]

Finally a video that talks about the fourteen points and the result that will have occurred if it was used instead of the treaty of Versailles awesome video

[toa_cracau]

Here’s an idea for a video: what if America did not get a place in the negotiations for the piece treaties, so france is pretty much free to do what it wants with Germany, Britain does the same with the colonies, the treaty of London is FULLY followed for Italy’s portion of the treaty and more, it could be a cool idea

[razvanrotundu]

Mr Z, congratulations for this material. A good alternate history but there is one point that I cannot see happening under any circumstances: France ceding Corsica to Italy and British Empire giving up Malta willingly. The two societies were completely shattered after the war and in no mood for ceding territories. Maybe a French government would have accepted an exchange Corsica for Vale d'Aosta but even this seems unlikely. As for the British Empire Malta was essential in the arhitecture of their control of the Mediteranean shipping routes.

[gfresh]

One of your best videos! Really in-depth and well put.

[moledaddy]

The underlying belief, that academics and so-called experts could create peace, is the problem of the 14 points.

[TheHatersarebad]

What if China collapsed during the Three Kingdoms Period and never reunited? What would the cultural and linguistic effects be? How would it affect Asia and Europe?

[CasualGamingDad]

What if Japan sided with the Allie’s in ww2? Japan had a good relationship with Poland due to them both hating Russia. Maybe once Russia invaded Poland japan could work something out with the Allies and get a few islands and the oil they need for there navy in exchange they would attack Germany. The Allies would also have to declare war on Russia to help Poland.

[sergeantmajor_gross]

The rise of National-Socialism wasn’t just about the Treaty of Versailles. They truly became popular during the Great Depression and the economic turmoil, inflation and political instability it caused

[Runenschuppe]

I highly doubt that the 14 points could have led to any peaceful future as a lot of the demands in there were contradictory. The paper champions the idea of self-determination, but focuses on nation (ethno-)states and finally tries to marry that with strategic concerns like access to the sea. None of those could have been even remotely satisfyingly resolved in the highly diverse countries of Central and Eastern Europe of the time. Wilson's "experts" were incredibly naive ivory tower scholars who had no idea of the actual realities on the ground. Culture, economic concerns and religion played a much bigger role than ethnicity even in the time of nationalism.

One of the best examples for his folly is Alsace-Lorraine. The Alsace is (largely to this day) ethnically and linguistically German - but culturally French. The people there would have very likely voted to be a part of France if somebody had asked them (preferably with some sort of regional autonomy clause). However, Wilson himself excludes Alsace-Lorraine in the 14 points from the principle of self-determination. Wilson also determines that Poland and Serbia need access to the sea without even bothering to ask if the Montenegrins or Kashubians wanted to become a part of those countries, because he considered them to be ethnically Serbian and Polish respectively - a lot of them might have disagreed.
There's many other examples: The Memel-Lithuanians were actually quite happy within Prussia. Prussia had allowed them to preserve their own language and culture (it was even an important retreat for Lithuanian nationalists from the other side of the border), but they were Protestant - not Catholic like the rest of Lithuania. Something they faced repression for after they were annexed by Lithuania. Would Trieste have wanted to become a part of Italy if somebody had told them they'd become a forgotten border village instead of the prestigious Austrian Adria port?

How do you deal with areas were the cities are one ethnicity, but the surroundings are of another? Lwow, Pressburg, Trieste, Marburg a.d. Drau, etc. Those issues were only really resolved through the ethnic cleansings during and after WW2.

With a few exceptions, the borders could and should have remained largely the same and the internal issues should have been dealt with increases to autonomy. Look at the German minority in modern Belgium - they have no interest in returning to Germany because of how overblown their input is in Belgian politics. South Tirol only stopped being a major issue for Italy once they became a) part of the European Union together with Austria and b) autonomous (an autonomy their Lombard and Venetian neighbors are now jealous about).


Let's face it. People don't really care who they are governed by as long as they are left in peace, can practice their culture, and have options to socially climb.

[assyrianchristian]

sad no Assyrian mention but still a great video as usual