How Bad Is The M113 APC?

The American M113 Armored Personnel Carrier was developed to provide the US Army with a low-cost, air-deployable, and mobile troop transport. It saw extensive use during the Vietnam War and has seen action in pretty much every conflict the US has been involved in since then. It's often heavily lambasted since it's championed by reformers, but exactly how bad is it?

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How Bad Is The M113 APC?

[ShadowsOfTheSky]

I talked to my grandpa, who lost his leg in Vietnam while walking with an armored division including M113s, a few weeks ago. He said that the M113 would’ve obviously been useless against a tank, but were like a mobile fortress against the under equipped enemies. Able to provide adequate mobile protection for a number of soldiers and provide good supporting fire from the .50 cals, everybody felt much better when one was around.
Able to hit decent highways speeds, the ability to carry so many infantry safely right into the heat of battle is a massive tactical advantage.
Obviously, the vehicle isn’t perfect, but it was quite well suited to the strange conditions of Vietnam.

[frankfreeman]

Good sir: My name is Frank Freeman. At the end of 1967 or very beginning of 1968 (old fart disease, I really can't remember), I was an Air Force radio maintenance technician, Ssgt., assigned to the 601st Tactical Control Maintenance Squadron at Sembach, Germany. We were Depot level maintenance, which means we fixed the radios that the techs at the squadrons couldn't fix. The Air Force had recently introduced the MRC-107 jeep-mounted radio system for use by forward air controllers in support of the Army. That was one of the two systems I was personally responsible for. It had HF, VHF and UHF radios all mounted on a pallet where the back seat of the jeep was supposed to be.
We had just figured out that in the field, the jeep could not always stay with the tracked vehicles, which limited it's effectiveness as air support provider. They decided to try to fit the radio system of the 107 to an APC, but the Army insisted that it had to be done with no changes to the M-113. Some way that would allow the radio pallet and antennas to be transferred quickly into the 113, and then back, if necessary.
I drew the assignment to make that happen. They dropped a 113, I don't know which version, off at my Squadron, and I personally and single handedly figured out how to do it. I got it working and it was field tested and worked well. I removed the system and they took the APC back. Of course I drove it a couple of times, because I was strictly ordered not to!
Anyway, I left the Air Force after Vietnam, so I never really heard what they did with the system. But I was watching TV news at the start of the drive in Desert Storm, and I actually saw a 113 with my antenna configuration, streaking across the desert, and felt really proud.
Thank you for your time if you read this!

[whybndsu]

People forget what the M113 is for, it's a battle taxi and the modern incarnation of the Bren carrier. It's lightly armored but can be airlifted, is moderately amphibious, can transport men and material across various kinds of terrain and can mount various weapons from MGs to mortars to autocannons.


Lastly, it can also become the ultimate weapon if you put wings and an engine on it and arm it with AIM-9 Sidewinders in the form of the Aerogavin

[MrArgus]

I think it's harder to find APCs that infantrymen do NOT call "deathtraps" in some form or another.

[Orangefan]

I love how the opening of the video is the M113 climbing like a 1* grade, something which is impossible for it to do in War Thunder

[higgs]

Served with the USN in Vietnam's Mekong Delta 20 klicks upriver from Can Tho. The M113 was the only armored unit that the Army could reliably deploy in that area due to the water table being so close to the surface of the ground. Tanks were vulnerable to getting stuck in the dry season, hopeless when it rained.

[sixgunsymphony]

Critics of the M-113 want it to be a tank. They dont grasp the role of an APC.

[jasonxd]

Having driven one of these in real life, they're slow, but not nearly as slow as WT makes them. Believe it or not they CAN climb hills with relatively little trouble. That's my biggest gripe with how they are portrayed in game

[FlightSimHistorian]

My grandpa got his 3rd Purple Heart while riding on top of a 113 in Vietnam. He got his helmet clipped by an enemy sniper shot. If he'd been wearing his helmet correctly, the bullet would likely have killed him. As it happened, his helmet strap was undone, so the bullet glanced off, spinning his helmet around, causing a severe burn due to the helmet liner. He had a scar running all the way around his head.

[pinkycatcher]

My Uncle was in an M113 in Vietname when it was hit by an RPG, he was the radio guy and made it out alive. They can take some damage and keep the people inside (mostly) alive. If you search for "The Battle for Buttons", he was in Lt. Andrews ACAV. There's a paper one of the guys involved wrote about it, and has some very dramatic pictures.

Also there's a note in there about the crews doing unauthorized "mine plate" upgrades to protect against mines

[dodobird]

Spookston's mention of the Grim reaper M48 made me look it up
by my count, that's 6 machineguns in total, four of them were .50 cals, three of which were on tripods welded to the tank. There was the coax .30 cal, and then one final M60 in the bustle rack
tank also mounted a Minigun ripped from a cobra, and a M79 grenade launcher in the ready rack, along with a folding stock m14 and a few other rifles

Some real rpg protagonist moments there

[bobisbell]

I was a scout and drove the 113 and tc'd them. They served well in a scout role and an anti armor role. It wasn't meant to take more than 7.62mm small arms fire. Easy to maintain and mobility was great

[ablebravo]

We had M113s with RPG cages and an extra 1/4 inch or so of steel on the sides (Ramadi, 2007). They were loud, but they were terrific for moving troops around, and made amazing CASEVAC vehicles. The mortar carriers in particular were great for CASEVAC because the compartments for round stowage were also perfect for medical supplies. We usually didn't bring them on raids, but that was primarily due to their size with the cages attached, but they made great OPs, gates for outposts, CASEVAC like I said, you could move half of the platoon with one (we were at 60% strength). They were great for what we used them for.

We did have one roll over a mine, though, and that aluminum floor ripped open like a banana peel. Like it literally ripped open and bent upwards. It made hamburger out of the medic, and the driver was literally cut in half. The TC was found about 20 feet away. He'd been blown clear and knocked unconscious. Dude was confused AF but otherwise fine.

[brothergrimaldus]

Was in one version, FiST-V, for years. It did its job. It's just the like TOW launcher you're using in the game, but without the missiles. It was just to house our LDR and thermal scope.

B-FiST (Bradley FiST) was coming in just as I was getting out.

[UkrainianPaulie]

I was an 11C. In West Berlin we had the 4.2 inch Mortar Carrier version the M106A2. It was reliable and rarely broke down. I liked it.

[scernefhaal]

Btw I extremely love this new type of voiceover that you have in your later videos: the one where you are talking more live-is, without just constantly reading a script. It makes your videos feel a lot more alive, as well as it is better to get your point based in emotional factor of the voice line

[MacMcNurgle]

Was a trooper in the mid 80's. B Squadron. First year driving for a Lance Corporal. Named my 113 'Beast' and stencilled it in black on the side. Tore that sucker a-part. Even today I can tell you the ground pressure, ground clearance and max slope angle. Next year I drove for the Serge. I knew how to do daily AND weekly maintenance when in the bush; as well brew good coffee. That 113 was 'Behemoth' and I stripped her down to the rubber seal on the inspection plate on the bottom of the hull. Good thing too, as I was first to drive off the Tobruk while 200m off the beach. Serge made sure my boots were not laced up. Just in case. We didn't sink. But when we tested the bus prior to the real thing, we were in a man-made concrete culvert that was on base. Full of stinky water. Serge and I drove into this test ditch and the next thing I see Serge walking next to me. Big grin on his face. You know that grin. It means someone's having fun. Probably not you. He had abandoned the sinking, stinking ship. So much for being a 'float' test. He smiles some more and says - you better speed it up before she gets too heavy. The seals were bad and I could only drive up the ramp out of the float test bay by lowering the ramp and letting the water out. I checked every vehicle in the Squadron after that. Replaced every seal. Float tested every machine. Last year in I had developed good radio skills and most importantly, knew the secret of making an excellent jaffle; so I drove the Captain on the Cooktown to Cohen jaunt that year. Yanks and SAS were Blue Force. On the third radio I heard someone describe the show as a 'cluster f$%k' and I laughed hard. The RSM was not so happy. After a while we were getting close to Cohen and there was a long straight track with a cross roads about half a click off. Cap said - Driver, cross that dirt road. I said - are you sure, Blue Force are ... Yes, was the smiling reply. About thirty seconds later a referee jogs over to tell us that an RPG just wiped us out. Cap says - oh well then, 24 hours till we are back as reserves. Lets drive back to RHQ. Nice. We got a rest and the LT got to run the show for a while. Get some experience leading for a bit. Cap, he was a good man. Not happy about the stock market crash that hit while he was in the bush. Little servo on the track North to Nowheresville knew we were coming. Had t-shirts printed, cold drinks, porno mags and a metric ton of coins for the pay phone. Ha! That dates it. Cap saw the three day old paper and immediately got $20 in coins for the phone. He called his broker in Sydney and tried to sell everything but it was too late. In a funk after that, Cap tried to order in some ice cream through stores. And an actual bathtub. Not a canvas one. A real one. Everything the army has, has a number. That number is is in a book. He had a book. The Quarter Master was not well pleased. Funny. But the next lot of ration boxes delivered were older than me. Hmmm. There's rank, there's position and then there's power. Lesson learnt. Wasn't allowed to name the old girl as we were 'in polite company' on that run. But I called her 'Brutal'. It was the best job I ever had and the worst job I ever had.

[briansmithwins]

The armor is good enough to keep out most artillery & mortar fragments which have been the biggest killer of infantry since WWI. It's not perfect but it was a pretty good product for its time.

[JMAN-pgtg]

As someone who’s spent a lot of time driving, commanding, and riding in a M113 during my army career, I really liked the vehicle. The only real gripe we had was there was no A/C…

[RavenholdIV]

I used to drive them quite a bit. Great fun! They were able to climb almost any slope that was on offer. I don't think I ever saw one slide off something, but we were in the desert so the ground was pretty good for tracks. It makes me hate the warthunder olive oil nerfs everything got. I have personally climbed mountains in the damn thing, I know just how effective tracked vehicles are. Riding up and down the waddis at a crawl was pretty spicy, especially when the sides were approaching 45 degrees, but the only thing that ever flipped was the Strykers. Still made me sweat lol. Gotta be so ginger with those brakes or you could flip the whole thing over it's nose.