Good Flag, Bad Flag: The Limits of Simple Design

So I was inspired to make this video after watching a great critique from @premodernist_history from a historical perspective. I started thinking about how to answer his good faith question of why simple design is better, and the more I unpacked it, I realised it wasn't so straightforward. Looking forward to a "lively" discussion in the comments section in this one!

00:00 A not-so-alternate reality
01:05 NAVA's "Good Flag, Bad Flag" pamphlet by Ted Kaye is influential for a reason
03:09 Examining the guidelines - Principle 1: Keep It Simple
05:49 Principle 2: Use Meaningful Symbolism
06:20 Principle 3: Use Two to Three Basic Colors
06:36 Principle 4: No Lettering or Seals
07:33 Smart Adaptation Tactics - Streamline, Extract or Remix
09:05 Principle 5: Be Distinctive or Be Related
09:21 Other Considerations and the Point of Design Guidelines
11:32 GFBF Reimagined, Focused on City & State Flag Redesigns
13:31 Building on the legacy of "Good Flag Bad Flag"

[LinusBoman]

*Corrections* to be pinned here!
I'll start by adding some nuanced points that couldn't quite fit the script:
- My perspective comes as a graphic designer and branding specialist with almost two decades of experience. I've edited and written dozens of design guidelines and likely read hundreds, ranging from broad "visual identity guidelines" to specific ones for everything from vehicle branding, advertising campaigns, motion graphics, signage, wayfinding, app icons, etc. I bring that lens to my critique of GFBF, treating it as if I were approaching it like a design guideline. Though it's not a perfect genre match, I hope this perspective is enlightening, as it's not one I've seen shared on this topic before.
- While it's possible some designers did contribute to GFBF uncredited, the broader point is that NAVA is not primarily a design organisation. By their own description, they're "Flag Enthusiasts and Scholars, " and Ted Kaye himself has no formal design background. Flag design projects aren't common enough to sustain a dedicated professional niche, let alone a specialist design agency, so it's remarkable how effectively it communicates its ideas about design.
- The Brazilian flag has lettering, and I don't think it should be removed. It works for various reasons: a) it's not a nametag, and b) it's not Helvetica. But mostly, it's one of those exceptions. I wouldn't highlight it in a design guideline.
- The redesign of the Portuguese government brand identity was rejected not just for aesthetic reasons; there were political reasons too, beyond the scope of this video.
- I've used the American spelling "color" because that's how it appears in the original. Try to remain unperturbed.
- 9:05 "Destinctive" a typo - mea culpa.

[vampiremonkeyonspeed]

Rule 1 - Comic sans on all flags
Rule 2 - Feature photorealistic prints of local dignitaries
Rule 3 - Rectangles are boring, enhance your flag by giving it a unique shape

[EliStettner]

You flirt with making a competing flag design pamphlet. It would be quite interesting if you were to publish that; it could be a useful source of moderation with the flag redesign people.

[modalmixture]

My children, gather round and I shall tell you about the year the Flag Wars began, and the TEDx talk heard round the world that started it all.

[stevethepocket]

I think the "a child could be able to draw it from memory" way of expressing principle 1 is more useful than principle 1 by itself, if you interpret it in a nuanced way. Like, the kid doesn't have to be able to draw it perfectly, just well enough that you can tell what flag it's supposed to be. Which also means the flag has to be distinctive and unconfusing enough to be remembered in the first place; think of how many European flags are easy to get mixed up with each other because they're just palette swaps of the same ultra-basic design.

[newcantinacrispychickentac]

Alternate title: Good "Good Flag Bad Flag" Bad "Good Flag Bad Flag"

[thatvillainjay]

Sir, a second anti "good flag bad flag" video has hit the discourse

[-NV-]

Someone call CGP Grey, his sacred text is being called into question

[premodernist_history]

What's missing in the whole flag discourse in our society is a discussion of what state and city flags are even for. The arguments I hear about certain things like lettering or too much detail making a flag less "effective" don't resonate with me because as far as I can tell, flags serve no practical purpose; they're just cultural symbols to represent identity. Whether a certain detail is discernible from a distance is therefore immaterial. And it doesn't matter if the design or symbolism is immediately readable or understandable to a cultural outsider, because it's not about them, it's about the in-group's collective self-expression.

But I suspect other people would disagree with me about what a flag's purpose is. This is what we as a society need to hash out when talking about flags. Why do we have a state or city flag? What problems does the existence of the flag solve? I don't mean answering "How is this new design a solution, " but rather, "How is the flag itself a solution, " i.e. any flag as opposed to no flag. We have to answer those questions before we can decide how good a given design is, or whether certain elements (e.g. lettering) are appropriate to include. Until then we'll all just be talking past each other.

Thank you for the mention! And thank you for making this video. I'm glad a greater variety of views on flag design is being expressed after the GFBF monoculture of the past decade.

[JJMcCullough]

So refreshing to hear the perspective of someone who actually knows about design. So many of the flagsperts have no real design knowledge or training so their theories are just based on half-informed feelings based on a very limited set of case studies.

[it_is_timbo]

Scott Wadsworth of Essential Craftsman cited a quote once that really sticks with me, from Harry Day the British WWI flying ace - "Rules exist for the strict adherence of fools, and for the informed guidance of wise men"

Unfortunately, treating rules as unbreakable dogma really extends to broken thinking in many parts of life. Great presentation and insight as always, Linus!

[martinkurien]

I’m very here for the “Good Flag, Bad Flag” Othodoxy backlash.
This is exactly how I feel about the present ways people are approaching flag design, namely CGP Grey.

I think 99% Invisible ultimately communicated the ideas of this pamphlet well without adhering to these rules in absurd ways. They actually tried to discuss a way to get started with flag design and NOT a grading scale of flags. I guess you get much more engagement if you do the latter.

Great response to the Premodernist by the way! I left a comment addressing how how the “simplicity” and “can a child draw it” rules are more about remix-ability, motif expression at various scales, memorability of themes, and usability in various contexts. The purpose of a good flag is civic engagement! Call it a form of branding, but people like symbols of things they value. It does mean something and that doesn’t always have to be bad.

[MedlifeCrisis]

Took me a good minute to understand why you chose the ‘green flag’ ‘red flag’ rating system. I am not a smart man. PS Nepal ftw

[mebamme]

I've always found it interesting how people are so quick to bash the "minimalist logo" trend, but everyone seems to like e.g. the Japanese prefecture flags.

Instead of "seals on a bedsheet", we now have "logos on a rectangle".

[pascalfibonacci]

I have to say this is the most nuanced take I have seen on flag redesign, and I'm not at all surprised given your background.

[ESC.cherrycola]

I don't know how the popular narrative has gone from "follow these rules at all costs" to "never trust these rules again" the moment old out of touch politicians started making bad flags.

[niivai]

I noticed that more complex flags usually only work when they are still a distinctive design when all the details are stripped away

For example Brazil becomes a blue circle on that yellow shape on green, or the US becomes a dotted blue rectangle on red/white stripes, number of dots and stripes aren't important

As a counterexample those seal on blue state flags become white circle or blob on blue, which on it's own is probably fine but there are like 30 of them and many of the seals aren't even mostly white so the blob hasn't got one dominant color

[memyselfishness]

A legitimately thought you were going to critique the designs of flags found within the Bible and was very confused because I didn't think there were any graphic designs in the Bible

[crediblesalamander]

the last part of the GFBF is the best part. i wholeheartedly disagree with the idea of not showing exceptions because "it's an unspoken rule". the pamphlet was clearly communicating that good flag design can break all the rules, which is very very important, since this isn't aimed at just designers, but a more general public. they've always been guidelines and im not a fan of the idea that the pamphlet somehow promotes strict adherence to any of them.

[StereoTyp]

Oh boy, vexillology fights! I'm here for it!