Could Humans Survive the Mesozoic? Neanderthals vs Dinosaurs

Could early humans--specifically Neandertals--survive in the Mesozoic? Will their spears, usage of fire, and sociality be enough to keep them alive in a world dominated by carnivorous monsters and walking earthquakes? Late Jurassic North America was a brutal place, with searing heat, a lack of flowering plants, and plenty of reptilian superpredators to keep the humans occupied. Dinosaurs like Ceratosaurus, Allosaurus, Torvosaurus, and Saurophaganax were the apex predators of the Morrison Formation, and the giant herbivores like Camarasaurus, Brachiosaurus, Supersaurus, and Apatosaurus are much more difficult targets than the elephants that these Neanderthals were used to hunting. Will our hominid relatives thrive...or get eaten alive?

00:00: Could Neanderthals Survive the Mesozoic?
01:18: What We Think We Know About Neanderthals
04:41: The Morrison Formation (Home)
06:38: Vegetation and Prey (Hunger)
10:42: Predators and Competitors (Hanger)
14:20: Domesticating Native Predators

Thumbnail art versions by kepyle2055, Arturo Garcia, SkymanPaleo, Mario Lanzas, Fred Wierum, and Rudolf Hima

Soundtrack chiefly done by Paleowolf.

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[TheVividen]

REFERENCES

Cave hyenas niche-partitioned with Neandertals, taking chiefly medium-sized prey while Neandertals focused on mammoths and other large herbivores
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Neanderthal and Homo sapiens cranial trauma Beier et al. 2018






Camptosaurus speed: Foster, J. (2007). "Camptosaurus dispar." Jurassic West: The Dinosaurs of the Morrison Formation and Their World. Indiana University Press. p. 219-221.





Ceratosaurus diet: Changyu Yun (2019). "Comments on the ecology of Jurassic theropod dinosaur Ceratosaurus (Dinosauria: Theropoda) with critical reevaluation for supposed semiaquatic lifestyle" (PDF). Volumina Jurassica. XVII: 111–116.

[killdozer]

Neanderthal Kid: "He followed me home, can I keep him?"
Him: (a massive Allosaurus)

[michaelhamar]

so basically neanderthals have 2 option evolve into hobbit like orborial creatures or evolve into primarch sized gigachad hunters (or just died out)

[crossovertrainfan]

This takes the whole caveman and dinosaur trope to a whole new level.

[Don-dsdy]

Being a neanderthal myself...how i would hunt dinosaurs is with a really big sharp stick. Maybe throw some bigger rocks than usual.

[MadlyMesozoic]

Peak (I will never do humans in a different time period)

[unfezanter]

I feel that dinosaur eggs would greatly increase hunger score, as large sauropod nesting sites could be easy meals and protean for neanderthals between hunts. Even if they are guarded, neanderthals could use groups and distractions to lure away dinosaurs. Its arguable that humans poaching eggs is what caused moa and elephant bird extinctions, so i can see dinosaurs recieving a similar but lessor treatment.

[MadlyMesozoic]

From now when anyone asks me to make a similar video i will simply link this one

[harrywhyatt]

Pit fall traps for dinosaurs would be a super easy method of sourcing large quantities of food.

[SamuRhino]

Imagine a tribe of Neanderthals hunting a massive stegosaurus. They struggle and begin to retreat. And then an 8 ton Saurophaganax pulls up and kills it no-problem. Absolute cinema

[AmericanAdvancement]

Excellent video as usual and I would largely agree with the assessment. I believe the best formation for Neanderthals to survive in would have been the Yixian formation since it’s rather cold, has a fair share of big game, and a comparative lack of big predators.

With all that said, I believe that you missed something important that would have aided the Neanderthals in survival and that is the truly vast supply of juvenile sauropods that would all be fending for themselves. One sauropod would have laid anywhere between 15 and 40 eggs per clutch as the Auca Mahuevo site indicates. If there were 100 sauropods in a herd that laid eggs around the same time of year then that means that there would be anywhere between 1, 500 and 4, 000 little sauropods roaming around. Add in the fact that it takes many years for a sauropod to grow and you have an ecosystem filled to the brim with sauropods of the size that Neanderthals would consider ripe for harvest.

[ikengaspirit]

12:50 it was Killing random humans in highly urbanized society and a stealth hunter. I am pretty sure it fares differently when the humans are wilderness folk and it isn't an ambush hunter.

[UnwantedGhost-anz]

I wouldn't be here sooner if not for Madly Mesozoic's Discord. This is going to be hype.

[codypass]

No wonder Spear's tribe got obliterated in PRIMAL. At least they didn't go down without a fight.

[ThatOneBiologist-mjff]

As a biologist I'd say I think you're really short selling human creativeness. Spears may not be able to pierce hide but the same argument could be made about mammoths. The main difference is that sauropods and stegosaurus have small heads with less weaponry in that spot than elephants. Not to mention traps and fire used as a weapon would really level the playing field here. Also stealing eggs is a viable strategy in an ecosystem abundant in large animals that leave eggs unguarded. Also, since sauropods likely gave less parental care than modern elephants, young and smaller individuals would be less dangerous to hunt. Honestly that alone might cause a collapse that would take care of the largest theropods in the Morrison.

Edit: I also think you are overlooking the reason we have so many fossils from that locality in the first place: it was easy for sauropods to get trapped in mud and die and there could be potentially mass graveyards like this. Sure, theropods would be attracted to it as well, but the sheer volume of meat would still be a potential large food source, especially if some tribe members are using fire to ward off predators trying to steal.

I'd give the Neanderthals a rating of 6-7.

[Misto_deVito]

Doing what Madly never would... you're a hero!

[crockast]

7:54 you also have to remember that meat would spoil a lot faster in the heat of the Morrison, so bringing down large game would just result in a much higher risk to the hunters with no increase in reward

[docc]

12:53 I think it's important to mention that Neanderthals were FAR stronger than their homo sapiens counterparts. Untrained female Neanderthals were speculated to be able to lift around 320-350 Lbs.

I feel like a regular hunter-gatherer tribe of Neanderthals (familiar with dealing with big cats and bears) would likely handle the champawat tiger far better compared to the small impoverished farming villages of homo sapiens it often targeted.

Also. the tiger mostly went for women & children.

This is a very great video otherwise and I greatly thank you for creating it.

[DreadEnder]

I love that after asking YouTube to notify me of this it notified me of everything but this.

[TheVividen]

Shoutout to Wood Pigeon, who joined the channel after this video was completed! Thank you for your support!