Destiny 2 Lore - The Echoes Finale, The Morale Question & my thoughts on the story.

Destiny 2's Lore and Story in Echoes has wrapped up and so today I thought I'd briefly recap it, whilst giving my thoughts on where Destiny is right now, as well as how the story performed. Suffice to say things aren't great and whilst Echoes wasn't perfect I still think it'll be unfairly tarnished by the reflections of the current climate and how they're affecting our perceptions of Destiny generally.

[briangreen]

When this Episode first started I was excited that the Vex would actually become part of the story and not just a plot device for other factions. And instead, it feels like I got a duo of lovers quarrels...

[TCB_Repentless]

The Maya as the Conductor reveal absolutely should have been the Act 1 finale. They weren't able to properly pace the story because it dragged for so long initially and then didn't leave them enough time to flesh out the results/consequences of that reveal.

[markricheard]

Super disappointed we never got an actual boss fight with Maya. Just fight her weak replacement for Argos, the Nessus Planetary Core Mind. Hell, I would have accepted Maya “possessing” a Vex boss and she speaks to us while we fight that.

I wish this Episode explored the Golden Age and its mysteries way way more than “Maya is trying to recreate the Golden Age solely to find her Waifu again” what if a group of Neomuna Citizens held lots of respect for Maya due to her being one of their legendary “Founders” and act as Double Agents to help convert the Neomuna Vex? What if Maya was able to successfully recreate bits and pieces of a Golden Age City and it comes through like the Time-Tears on Mars? What if Maya uses Neomuna Nanites to forge a powerful new version of Vex who can convert other Vex through touch? The possibility’s were endless here and they ignored all of that because “oh surprise lol Maya is God-Roll Farming her perfect Girl because she’s down bad.”

[Lugai]

Funny you talk about our characters not doing anything. At the end of week 2 when we finally see The Conductor and she controls Saint-14 once again then we evacuate, I jokingly said “We could have easily just shot her” as our guardian was unaffected at that time

[cameronmelville]

Instead of Ikora being there, it should've been Osiris. As much as it was Saint reasserting himself, it also features Osiris doubting his own choices in the past. He had more on the line than Ikora did and just because he's lightless doesn't mean he's not capable. Give Ikora, Crow and Zavala time to work away as a fireteam in the background while other characters like Saint, Mithrax etc centre stage on these episodes

[comhaltacht]

I actually hate how we didn’t get to see Saint kill Maya. One of the most powerful guardians ever and his shield dings her. I really want to see our mentors kick ass for once.

[jonathanmumbi]

I feel like this episode drives home just how terrifyingly accurate vex simulations are. How they are indistinguishable from reality. The simple fact that Maya killed her Chioma says it all.

[Atticuss]

If the cutscene would have ended with vex coming under her control on Europa and marching towards Clovis bray I would have felt that "Oh Shit" moment about her getting away. Ikora even brought up clovis.

[bepisboye]

The story had a fantastic skeleton and concepts, but the execution was simply mid. We're meant to be in the epilogue of Final Shape and the Light and Darkness saga but ultimately, nothing happened, or at least it feels that way. I understand the Episodes are meant to be self-contained stories and are setting up villains for the future, as stated by Bungie themselves, but the problem is that this isn't the time for filler. How does this connect into Revenant, if at all? We learned basically fuck-all about the Echo and it's not a "stay tuned" situation like the Veil was, we at least knew we'd learn more about the Veil in the future, but it was set up that each Echo would be dealt with in their respective Episode and here we are with Maya MIA in a very unsatisfying conclusion and no idea how we are moving forward.

The dichotomy between Osiris and Saint, and Maya and Chioma, was handled *somewhat* well. I'm getting really tired of Osiris and Saint's relationship being forced front and centre like they aren't their own people in the world, when both men have been built up as really competent characters. On the other hand, they did well to show how Saint and Osiris supported each other despite their faults, especially when both Osiris and Maya are control freaks, and how Maya and Chioma's relationship descended into abuse when they didn't have the support structures Saint and Osiris have. It was a really cool dynamic despite my annoyance surrounding the writing of Osiris and Saint's relationship.

Maya's set up as a villain was really god damn metal, yet had god awful pacing. Having her be so far gone she kills her lover hundreds of times over to find the "correct" one is really chilling and a great way to make us hate her as a villain, yet the reveal came too late in my opinion and should have been sooner to give us a reason other than the Echo to chase her. The natural evolution of her controlling nature being that she obtains the Echo of Command and decides she wants to shape the universe as the Witness did feels like a good, if a bit large, escalation, yet to learn nothing of the Echo on top of the awkward epilogue of "Look at what she could've been! She's still Human after all!" just felt off and disappointing.

The content was neither here nor there. The regular seasonal content was incredibly disappointing and felt underdeveloped after Lightfall's entire year of escalating experimentation in activity design, with Bungie stretching their legs a bit and making roguelite content in Destiny. On the positive side, when the mission actually worked, I think the Exotic mission was *really, really* good. It was on the longer side but didn't have any overly long mid-sections like Presage and Zero Hour. It was a challenge, but not insanely overtuned like Avalon was.

[TANKMASTER]

Byf is right. Saint shouting, "YOU ARE MY PEOPLE" was probably the best seasonal story climax they have made.

[Kezajaws]

Acts 1 and 2 really built up my hype for Act 3. And seeing the horrors that Maya committed on Chioma got me excited to have a final boss fight against her.
Bungie just needed to make the inflated balloon have a nice pop.
But they pricked the top of the balloon, letting all the air out without even the comedic fart sound to accompany it.

What disappoints me the most is the wasted potential.
We could have had permanent changes to Nessus.
We could have had Vex factions fighting each other.
We could have had some of Neomuna's citizens turning traitor because they respect Maya as one of the cities' founders.
We could have had Maya discovering and assuming control over a Vex frame we've never seen before, introducing it to everyone in the same way we were introduced to Hive Lightbearers, Tormentors and Subjugators.

Instead, we got busywork and repeated runs of an exotic mission which didn't even change aside from bonus objectives.
I don't want to judge Bungie too harshly for the wasted potential, but they clearly didn't learn their lesson about not making their players do the same damn thing week after week, and that's thoroughly pissed me off.

To be clear; I loved the story right up to the ending. But a bad ending to a good story is like getting a gone-off cake after the best steak dinner you've ever eaten.

[Dragolee]

One thing I hope bungie does is, as a result of maya separating these choral vex from the collective, one particular vex develops on its own, creating a new frame, learning to communicate and speak, and becoming a real actual face for the vex as a villain.

[colvamoon]

Honestly, learning how the good Mayas are, it makes me wish we had a Mayas vs Conductor cutscene.

[jacobrohde]

Simple fix in my opion the patrol zone itself shouldve changed as the story went along the changes visibly being seen and updated wouldve helped massivly

[Ace_O]

I absolutely detest the bs excuse of „breaking mind control through a strong will!“ That’s absolutely a stupid way of making a main cast immune to our villians power. It’s like having super strength but everyone else is stronger than you. Like what’s the point of having the power then?

[emperorholocron]

Honestly I’m really starting to resent the narrative team for not letting us kill villains they know would be satisfying.

Eramis, Maya, Xivû Arath. So now the story of the episode is over and Maya isn’t dead and we still haven’t secured The Echo. What the fuck do we do now? Just jump into Miisraxx’s Scorn Vampire Hunting?

[henrique_so_isso]

The coolest thing about the vex that I don't see anymore is the stories of existencial horror sorrounding them

[Velocity_AU]

Season of the Splicer continues to be the absolute best season, enjoyable gameplay, kick ass storyline, moments that really made me question everything, and question who the good guys were.

[Sedward]

13:07 YES! I’m so sick of seeing my character standing on the side while stuff happens. It has happened so many times and this scene in particular pushed me over the edge.

[scourgewatcher]

Was waiting for Asher to come in at the last minute to get it away from her while fixing his body...