Is the Apache Attack Helicopter Really Obsolete?

The AH-64 Apache Attack Helicopter has been in service since the 1980s. Since then the enemy has developed new high tech air defense networks with a range of over 300 kilometers. Some even go as far as to say the entire concept of attack helicopters is obsolete. But new doctrine, tactics and technology could keep the rotary aircraft in style well in the future.

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Written by: Chris Cappy & Diego Aceituno
Edited by: Savvy Studios
Produced by: August Dannehl

Most other attack helicopters around the world can’t carry anywhere near that much weight, usually having only 2 or 4 anti-tank missiles. The four hardpoints on the Apache’s stub wings can also be configured with different types of ordnance for different missions including Hydra rocket pods or AIM-92 Stinger air to air missiles. You might be wondering why you would want a smaller 2.7 inch diameter unguided hydra rocket but it's because they are used for saturation attacks to engage multiple targets hiding in a forest for instance. This allows you to suppress enemy air defense systems in a wide area.

We talked a fair bit about doctrine but what is one of the main tactics the Apache uses? It’s called the pop up attack where you hide behind a mountain or terrain feature then pop up just long enough to get a target lock and launch a fire and forget missile before ducking down below cover again. The Longbow millimeter-wave Fire Control Radar is what allows the helicopter to peak above ridgetops and acquire a detailed picture of the battlefield that pierces rain and dense fog.

The radar can track 128 separate targets, lock onto 16 at a time for engagements, and an integrated Aided Target Identification & Classification System can automatically prioritize contacts based on threat levels. Targeting data is shared among allied Apaches, allowing one to spot targets while others remain hidden.

Task & Purpose is a military news and culture oriented channel. We want to foster discussion about the defense industry.

#HELICOPTER #WAR #MILITARY

[Taskandpurpose]

Apache Helicopters provided close air support for my tour in Iraq and they were truly an outstanding platform for that war and its purposes. Most times the enemy didn't even bother to attempt to operate during the day when choppers were over head. However, how they would need to change tactics, mission planning and upgrade the Apache for a near peer battle is everyone's best guess at this point. The history of attack helicopters and the evolution of their strategy is fascinating. They've always faced criticisms for their vulnerability since their adoption. They way in which they are deployed will determine their success in the future.

[georgearrivals]

Attack helicopters are like tanks. Yes, the proliferation of MANPADS makes attack helicopters more vulnerable than before. However, like tanks, they are still a potent force-in-being. The mere presence of enemy attack helicopters in the AO presents a serious threat to everyone from the highest echelons of command to the lowest of grunts.

[johnned]

Actually Apaches used in the first Gulf War were used to simultaneously take out two interconnected Iraqi radar stations. This precise strike opened up a window in the Iraqi radar coverage allowing allied airpower to safely enter enemy airspace and kick off offensive operations.

[wyskass]

As summarized in video, the point of obsoletion is not just vulnerability but capability. 2 sides of the coin. Unless something better can do the job a system will remain viable despite vulnerabilities. The same can be said of human soldiers who are more vulnerable than any machine, yet are still used.

[stephensibert]

My late brother in law flew UH-1s and did his Cobra transition. This was in 1970s. He flew in Germany. He was a Georgia Tech Electrical Engineering grad, a tough undertaking all by itself. But he said flying a helicopter was the greatest challenge he ever undertook. Thanks for your fascinating program.

[thetexanbuzzsaw]

You can aim the gun simply by looking at the target. Regardless of how old the tech may be, it'll still always be badass.

[gsipos]

I was a co-creator (EE) of the Apache in the early 1980’s. Lots of fun and frustrating stories creating it. We designed it for the Soviet tank. Well done video.

[Myytzlplk]

Had an uncle who was a Huey pilot in Vietnam. His best friend was his co-pilot, and he saw him die by head wound in a hot landing zone. He never spent an hour not drunk for the rest of his life. Nice guy

[anonemus]

I was a 35 Kilo avionics mechanic on the original Apache's back in the 80"s. I got to partake in the rollout of the first Apache full Air Cav squadrons. I was assigned to third unit to get the new choppers. It was the 2nd of the 6th Air Cav Brigade. It was so lethal that it could kill or cause permanent life altering injuries to the people who worked on it if proper by the book or you die procedures were not followed precisely. They would clear the hanger completely any time the laser system was tested because the original shroud they used to shield the laser emissions only partially blocked the laser. The static discharge from the air frame after the laser is used in flight will burn the marrow out of your bones and blow a hole in your body wherever it exits if it was not properly grounded before touching the aircraft. I was an awesome machine to get to work on and one of the highlights of my time in the Army.

[viggo]

Drones might take over most of the combat roles of traditional attack helicopters such as scouting and close air support, but as an armed troop transport i think the military helicopter will always be an invaluable asset for any modern army.

[Nero-Caesar]

I'm always shocked when people see x military vehicles or equipment being destroyed in a war and come to the conclusion that it must be obsolete. It's just what comes with war and especially in a extremely high intensity conflict like the one in Ukraine yes the Russians took a while to get into the swing of things but during the Ukrainian counter offensive the Ka-52 proved itself to be a real threat in my opinion. And if you believe Russian sources it was able to deflect 18 missiles in one engagement.

[vmasing]

I've seen Apache once in my life -- 2 of them were on a routine patrol flight around the _Andrews Air Base._ They were really fast while jumping up and down over the trees like frogs following the landscape. I had no idea something so heavy can do wild acrobatics like that. I remember thinking No way, this can't be real... but it was real.
I've seen videos about their crazy manoeuvrability before but when you see it in reality, that's when it suddenly hits you.

[jsinope]

I was going to cancel my order for an Apache but you’ve changed my mind! Great advice! Seriously. As a fan of Whitley birds, I loved the breakdown and comprehensive analysis that you and your team always bring.

[scarygarybusey]

My father was a tank driver between 1980 and 1983 before he got hurt and was honorable discharged. They played war games as an opfor with the Apache before 1984. He said you couldn't see it, you couldn't hear it and your tank was dead. He was most impressed with that and the A-10. Back then war games with tanks were a lot different than today but he said both of those machines was a tanks worst nightmare.

[seekrengr]

This episode brought back memories of engineering the TADS/PNVS thermal imagers on the AH64 back in 1977-1980 at Martin Marietta (now Lockheed Martin). They were indeed state-of-the-art FLIRs at the time. Those old scanning technologies have been superceded by staring FPAs today (MTADS), but they were optomechanical marvels.

[DerekIcelord]

I'm reminded of The Chieftain's response to the question of if tanks are (or are becoming) obsolete, a question largely spurred by the wide spread use of anti-armor weapons in Ukraine. "Tanks will continue to be used so long as nothing else can do what a tank does." Helicopters are the same. Nothing is invulnerable on the battlefield, but so long as something provides a capability better than another piece of equipment, it will continue to see use. It's like saying infantry is obsolete because a soldier can be taken out by any small arm the enemy uses.

[evananderson]

I watched a flight of these badboys, 5 of them flying in a wedge formation, go low over my neighbors field one day. I regularly see C-130s flying low over my house, but that was the only time I saw Apaches. It is a truly awe inspiring, terrifying sight. Im glad theyre on our side.


That said, I'd be working on a UAV that can carry half the payload at reduced cost, reduced personel risk, and similar loiter times if I worked for a defence contractor. The attack heli isnt obsolete, but I'd bet it takes on more of a command role with a swarm of UAV drones, similar to the NGAD.

[col.waltervonschonkopf]

To paraphrase the Chieftain, militaries generally don't replace or stop using a weapon system unless it becomes redundant or obsolete, even if the system becomes more vulnerable.

[nickbunch]

I flew in an HC-130 rescue bird and towed USAF Black Hawks with us. When you’re busy trying to rescue people in Afghanistan you don’t care who is flying Close Air Support. At one point we ran into an incident where we had marine cobras, army apaches, and Air Force A-10s, an AC-130, and a couple of F-16s flying at different altitudes all controlled by me and the awacs. When it comes down to it you don’t care who’s around to protect you as long as you know you’re safe while trying to prosecute your mission. There are times when all the US forces come together not worrying about who is who or what is what. We are all still brothers in arms at the end of the day

[davekisor]

Dad was in Korea when they called the AF for air support and were told their tactical aircraft were on strategic missions and had to wait until their aircraft returned, were turned around, refueled and rearmed. They didn't have that much time, but when Navy and Marine birds were looking for targets of opportunity, they were too glad to help. It got to the point where many Army units called the carriers directly. He was G2, saw every after action report and determined over half of the tactical air support the Army received ame from carrier flight decks.