This BANNED Technology Could Push Hydrogen Cars Over BEVs

This hydrogen technology was banned by the US government for years but now thanks to Sandy Munro's mention of it in one of our conversations this hydrogen electric car tech could actually propel hydrogen cars passed battery powered electric cars, and today I'm talking with the man behind the technology and the founder of Plasma Kinetics Paul Smith.

Sandy Munro talks about Plasma Kinetics:

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[Makatea]

You didn't ask the relevant questions: 1. What are the conversion losses in generarating the hydrogen and getting it onto the film?
2. How much does the hydrogen to film conversion device cost and how much energy does it consume?
3. How much does the conversion unit in the car cost, how heavy and how efficient is it?
4. At what point of production readiness are they and how much would a factory cost to produce those devices?
5. How high is the energy density on film compared to compressed (700 bar)/liquified hydrogen?
6. How is the hydrogen fixed onto the film and is there anything other than hydrogen coming off when it's getting lasered?
7. How does the cost compare to compressing hydrogen?

With this system, there are a lot more steps from the energy source to the motor: Regenerative power to hydrogen, hydrogen to film, film to hydrogen, hydrogen to the motor via fuel cell. All those steps have losses.

For BEVs it's solar panel to battery to motor with an overall efficiency of way over 80%. FCEVs are two to three times less efficient and it'd be interesting to know, how much better this technology might do.

It's all fine and dandy that lots of people are interested in a slightly less boneheaded way to store hydrogen but prototypes are easy...

[tarotaro]

getting my popcorn ready. someone is getting a chemistry 101 lecture here.

[jeffpope]

Plasma Kinetics sounds like a game changer! It does apply to long range trucking, extra terrestrial aircraft, and subterranean vehicles. Plus it's produced at windmills!

[SteveWithers]

Today, I charge my EV with solar power made on my roof. It's been a revelation to me. I'd have trouble now going back to an energy source I needed to rely on others to price and provide.

[ukebeleza]

Prototypes are easy, manufacturing is hard

[BigHtrades]

IMO: I enjoyed reading all the technical analysis and inherent known and unknown issues with this technology, but as a non-scientist, I would say the hydrogen fuel "discs" would need to be substantially cheaper than BEV per mile for the average person to be willing to change out multiple 15lb., discs for every 20 miles of driving, as opposed to plugging in a cord.

[makerspace]

Whenever I hear of a technology supposably being banned, I get skeptical. I'm not sure what could be banned about using a metallic hydride for storing hydrogen, the technique has been around for almost 50 years. The trick is to release the hydrogen from the hydride you need heat, the hydride cools as the hydrogen is released, which could aid in air conditioning, but where do you get the heat. Originally the thought was to burn the hydrogen in an ICE engine and use the exhaust heat to release more hydrogen. Not a bea idea, but terribly inefficient. Apparently the big deal here is using light to release the hydrogen, that's why the very thin film is required. The banned part is probably marketing hype.

[bilgyno]

The word BANNED in all caps in the title is the first sign that this is BS.

[markhodgson]

Hydrogen is not green energy. It is produced by either two methods. One. Separate the hydrogen and oxygen atoms in water which requires a lot of electricity. Two. Hydrogen is a by-product of the reformation of hexane molecules which are a straight chain 6 carbon and 7 hydrogen atoms. The catylist in the reformer removes one hydrogen atom which forces the hexane molecule to form a circular molecule called an olefin. This is gasoline . The removed hydrogen atom is then compressed and stored or simply burned off at the refinery flare. So to recap, either use heaps of electricity to produce it, or keep making gasoline.

[dougj]

This reminds of a story that was popular in the '70s and '80s. It was about a carburetor invention that allows cars to get 100mpg. Of course, it was blocked by the oil companies.

[Dli]

What blows my mind is how fool sells continue to amaze people who can't wrap their heads around thermodynamics... How is this extra contraption making the Rude Goldberg battery that is still an HFC PEM, with a new storage tank any better?

Why did I not hear about:
Energy density.
Power density.
Conversion efficiency.
How does this beat metal-hydrid storage.

[silverismoney]

This technology is the cold fusion of the 2020s. So many youtubers are going to go down with it.

[bminerrolltide]

The cost of producing green hydrogen is the real problem with hydrogen

[rickrack]

I worked for Quantum Technologies in Irvine CA when Toyota contracted us to develop high pressure storage tanks and delivery systems. It was very exciting work. We had experience with CNG tanks that we built for GM trucks and cars, so the technology just took a little tweaking for H2

[aussietaipan]

I think that all technologies for vehicles will have their strong and weak points as well as best suited scenarios. EV's for instance for me are the perfect daily driver to work and back. But I have a heavy boat to tow and also a large trailer that I use. Diesel at the moment gives me the pulling power, economy and range that I need, this is why I also have a diesel 4x4. I cannot imagine any other technology taking its place.

[desertflyer]

I drove a hydrogen-powered car in 1977 with hydrogen stored as Iron Hydride. It was pressurized in a tank to charge it, then heated slightly to release the hydrogen. The drawback was it was quite heavy. The other problem was the H2 attacks the metals in the engine of a retrofitted ICE. This has a lot more potential. But the idea of “solid state hydrogen” storage is not new per se.

[bad]

I just wish there was a way I didnt have to go to a "refueling" station. Someone needs to come up with some technology that allows you to refuel at your convenience, like maybe at home. Even better would be if you wake up full of energy everyday. Maybe one day.

[MoneyNothing]

"As we learned in high school hydrogen is positively charged"

Lolwut? My guy a hydrogen ion might be positively charged but hydrogen is usually H2 and is electrically neutral. You have a channel called E for Electric and you got so much basic stuff wrong in this video.

[brabenetz]

Best case scenario: It makes the Tank cheaper. But more expensive parts of a hydrogen system is the production of hydrogen and the hydrogen cell.
So the best case scenario for e-cars with hydrogen is still not enough to have chance against e-cars with batteries.
But hydrogen has a future in many other usages: Air-plains, Backup-Power-Supplies, Long-time-Storage (store energy in summer and use it in winter); maybe trucks (if autonomous, otherwise regulatory will order "charge"-breaks for the driver)

[tomattime]

A terrific double act. Being Sandy's straight man 👏🏽